Science and Technology news... :: View topic

Goofy · Guest

2 items of bad news for you Angelina:-

1) You>ll offend less users if you post tests in a dedicated "test" group,
rather than a "live" group.
2) The link to your pictures doesn>t work. ;-)

<angelina@erotismo.es> wrote in message
news:bm3u3a$1h5$1@localhost.localdomain...
[quote]Testeo of the News
--
Angelina
Mi Photo Gallery
http://62.101.161.3[/quote]

Guest · Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 7:33 pm Post subject: Re: Looking for true Auraucanas

Try Seven Oaks Game Farm. Claude used to sell eggs.

Dennis.

"Dale" <dalewspamfilter@lazerlink.com> wrote:

[quote]I know this is not a commercial forum, but we are looking for a source to
obtain some true Araucana adult hens, chicks (pullets preferred), or even
fertile eggs. We are located in the U.S. These birds would be an addition
to our small flock (~150) of very pampered, very spoiled, happy Ameraucanas
and Buff Orpington hens.

Thanks,

Dale

[/quote]
Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B>s are out of work."
To find out what an H-1B is and how they are putting
Americans out of work, visit the following web site
and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news video:
http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

laurie (Mother Mastiff) · Guest

Since we both live in NC and I could drive to pick them up, I have asked
Claude year after year for some (they are based on Terry Reeder>s line) and
he always says they are booked up several years in advance.

This isn>t laying season for most birds, and most breeders have already sold
off the birds they don>t want to feed through the winter. You could try
Nina Smith (in VA) who has Don Ryherd>s lines among others, she is at
guardiabul@naxs.net, or in the midwest, Nancy Utterback at
leeutterback@hotmail.com . Both have excellent birds and are straight-up to
deal with. (And unlike a lot of new folks who have misunderstood or
confused what they have heard but are eagerly selling eggs or chicks anyway,
these women know their birds.)

If you can>t get what you want this time of year, the smart thing would be
to get on their list NOW for eggs or chicks for spring.

Good luck! laurie (Mother Mastiff)

<n4mwd.dont.spam.me@amsat.org> wrote in message
news:3fab9ffa.10104871@rsnews.rapidsys.com...
[quote]
Try Seven Oaks Game Farm. Claude used to sell eggs.

Dennis.

"Dale" <dalewspamfilter@lazerlink.com> wrote:

I know this is not a commercial forum, but we are looking for a source
to
obtain some true Araucana adult hens, chicks (pullets preferred), or
even
fertile eggs. We are located in the U.S. These birds would be an
addition
to our small flock (~150) of very pampered, very spoiled, happy
Ameraucanas
and Buff Orpington hens.

Thanks,

Dale

Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B>s are out of work."
To find out what an H-1B is and how they are putting
Americans out of work, visit the following web site
and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news video:
http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm
[/quote]

craig tarrant · Guest

is you glass half empty?

C.M.German · Guest

someone forgot to take their meds again...............

if you>re really feeling that bad about yourself try this.........
http://www.needhim.org/

CM

Guest

[quote]I didn>t have to post Shawnee>s website(s) or her mother>s plea. There>s no
need. She has completely revealed herself here.

Now, back to trying to help people.
[/quote]

Help? No one needs your kind of help Norm.. Go back to the manic Depressive group where you
belong.. They like Zoloft and Lamictal eaters over there..

Message 1 in thread
From: Norman Chudacoff (ac146@LAFN.ORG)
Subject: Help Please

View this article only
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.tbi-support
Date: 1994-08-24 21:32:07 PST

Reply-ac146

Would someone help me to understand the term lability. I never heard
it until this board. I quickly looked it up in dictionary a while back.
Still don>t know what the different forms of the word are. Is labile the
basic form of the word? What are the other forms?

I developed a mood disorder following my brain injury (chemical exposure),
a lot depressive, a little manic. I attended a support group named "Ups
and Downs". Met and heard many substance abusers who claimed they
developed mood disorders as users, i.e. they didn>t have mood problems
before they began and "blamed" their substance abuse for the mood
problems.

What is the difference between being manic-depressive and being labile?
Thanks.

jake · Guest

On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 19:50:26 -0800, Norm@nospam.com wrote:

[quote]I didn>t have to post Shawnee>s website(s) or her mother>s plea. There>s no
need. She has completely revealed herself here.

Now, back to trying to help people.

Help? No one needs your kind of help Norm.. Go back to the manic Depressive group where you
belong.. They like Zoloft and Lamictal eaters over there..
[/quote]
He like to help people become a drug addict like himself more like..
or drive them crazy..
there must be a word for mental patients who try and pass as normal
and then badmouths and tries to blackmail others others for having
seen a psychiatrist?

[quote]
Message 1 in thread
From: Norman Chudacoff (ac146@LAFN.ORG)
Subject: Help Please

View this article only
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.tbi-support
Date: 1994-08-24 21:32:07 PST

Reply-ac146

Would someone help me to understand the term lability. I never heard
it until this board. I quickly looked it up in dictionary a while back.
Still don>t know what the different forms of the word are. Is labile the
basic form of the word? What are the other forms?

I developed a mood disorder following my brain injury (chemical exposure),
a lot depressive, a little manic. I attended a support group named "Ups
and Downs". Met and heard many substance abusers who claimed they
developed mood disorders as users, i.e. they didn>t have mood problems
before they began and "blamed" their substance abuse for the mood
problems.

What is the difference between being manic-depressive and being labile?
Thanks.
[/quote]

ChickenWing · Guest

This message contains a virus, don>t DL it.

On Wed, 31 Dec 2003 09:22:47 GMT, <billing@paysystems.com> wrote:

>Have a look the Pic attached !!

Jill · Guest

no
:~)
Happy New Year

--
regards
Jill Bowis

Pure bred utility chickens and ducks; Housing; Books, Gifts
Herbaceous; Herb and Alpine nursery
Holidays in Scotland and Wales
http://www.kintaline.co.uk

Guest · Posted: Sun Jan 25, 2004 10:07 pm Post subject: Re: New Vegan

On 21 Jan 2004 12:09:49 GMT, shantip1@aol.com (ShantiP1) wrote:

[quote]Even breathing and walking on the earth causes death to bugs and organisms.
[/quote]
Agreed.

[quote]I am on a vegan diet for health reasons and also because I don>t want to put
rotting flesh in my body.
[/quote]
How about if it>s not rotting?

[quote]I also don>t want the fear that those animals feel
before they die to go into my consciousness.
[/quote]
You contribute to more suffering by eating most bread than
by eating grass raised beef.

[quote]I>ve seen how those animals are
kept in the feed lots, and it>s a horrible site and I in no way want to
contribute to that.
[/quote]
I felt that way for a while. Then I talked to some people
who worked around them. The cattle love it. Once you get
them started eating grain like that, they don>t want to go
back to grass. The feed lot is a great place for them during
their final days.

[quote]Enjoy your steaks and I>ll enjoy my veggies, rice, grain, fruits, etc.
[/quote]
· From the life and death of a thousand pound grass raised
steer and whatever he happens to kill during his life, people
get over 500 pounds of human consumable meat. That would
be 750 meals if each included 3/4 pound of meat. From a grass
raised dairy cow people get thousands of dairy servings. Due to
the influence of farm machinery, and *icides, and in the case
of rice the flooding and draining of fields, one meal of soy or
rice based product is likely to involve more animal deaths than
hundreds of meals derived from grass raised cattle. Grass raised
cattle products contribute to less wildlife deaths, better wildlife
habitat, and better lives for cattle than soy or rice products. ·

Goofy · Guest

POST IT SOMEWHERE ELSE THEN.
Muppet.

<s24@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw> wrote in message
news:29010414.2829@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw...
[quote]Sorry sir!
I>m a student now.I have a studying about Spam Mail issuse
case.Therefore I need more and more spam mail for this study.

s1@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s2@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s3@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s4@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s5@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s6@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s7@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s8@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s9@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s10@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s11@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s12@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s13@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s14@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s15@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s16@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s17@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s18@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s19@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s20@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s21@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s22@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s23@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s24@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s25@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s26@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s27@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s28@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s29@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s30@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s31@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s32@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s33@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s34@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s35@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s36@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s37@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s38@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s39@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s40@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s41@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s42@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s43@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s44@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s45@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s46@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s47@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s48@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s49@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
s50@spam.mis.stu.edu.tw
[/quote]

Adia Thermanous · Guest

Meg wrote...
[quote]also: you suck for crossposting :P

So why didn>t you remove the offending froup from your reply? ;)

I didn>t notice it the first time. This time I wanted it known that it
wasn>t an intentional post to the offensive...sorry, *offending* froup. ;)
[/quote]
Well, now that you appear to have given up on the offensive froup, I took
the liberty of a quick google scan to find you some new ones. :D

Adia Thermanous · Guest

C.M.German wrote...
[quote]Maybe you could remove the sci.agriculture.poultry group from your list
also...........
[/quote]
Aw, what, you don>t want to read our crap? Me sad now. ;(

Guest · Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2004 8:41 pm Post subject: Re: Question for AR opponents

On Fri, 30 Jan 2004 21:08:22 -0500, "Eugene Khutoryansky" <Eugene@fdn.com> wrote:

[quote]
I am not trying to start a debate with this question, but am simply just
curious.

What would the AR opponents here think of an organization which does not
advocate AR, or even advocate vegetarianism, but focused exclusively on
working on outlawing factory farming and encouraging consumers to refrain
from purchasing factory farmed products?

Would you philosophically agree with the goals of such a group?
[/quote]
I would be more supportive of a group with the goal of improving life
for domestic animals, but not with the "AR" objective to eliminate them.
I>ve often pointed out that people can contribute to decent lives for
farm animals with their lifestyle, but they can>t do it by being vegan.
Simply pointing that basic fact out is often met with opposition from
"ARAs", which shows us that "ARAs" don>t care about animals nearly
as much as they pretend to.

[quote]For those that answer yes, would you consider participating in an
organization of this nature?
[/quote]
Maybe, but it would be hard to trust them not to be another
dishonest "AR" group, trying to make money in a different area.
If the group pointed out things "ARAs" are dishonest about, like:

1. they pretend to recognise animals' right not to be killed by humans
2. they pretend to want to promote better lives for domestic animals
3. they pretend that veg*nism somehow helps/saves farm animals
4. they pretend that veg*nism always involves less death and suffering than
any types of meat consumption
5. they pretend that vegans don>t contribute to most of the same animal deaths
that everyone else does
6. they pretend that "AR" would provide longer lives for domestic animals
7. they pretend to recognise animals' right to freedom
8. they pretend that "AR" would produce wild populations of animals from
domestic animals
9. they pretend that starvation, disease and non-human predators would be
better methods of wildlife population management than humans doing it directly
10. they pretend that animal medical research is of no value

Then I>d feel more confident that they were being honest. But, I don>t expect
to see it happen. Do you?

[quote]As I said, I am just curious.
[/quote]
It is an interesting thing. It would seem that at least *some* people would
want to promote decent lives for domestic animals. After all, we can>t do it
nearly as well for wildlife as we can for domestic animals, so why would people
not want to promote decent lives for domestic animals? But not only do the
people I>ve encountered not want to promote them, they are **very!!!** opposed
to the suggestion than anyone else even think about trying to do so.

[quote]-Eugene

http://ar.vegnews.org
(My animal rights web page)
[/quote]
_________________________________________________________
If we didn>t raise animals for food, then they would never have had the chance
to be born and experience life at all.

Considering how the vast majority of farm animals are currently raised in modern
industrialized agriculture, these animals would have been far better off never
having been born. The best moment in these animals lives is when they finally
die, because only then does their suffering finally end.

However, if the animals are raised and slaughtered humanely, some would say
that it is better for the animals to have experienced life for a brief time before
slaughter, rather than never have been born at all. My response to this is the
following.

Once an individual is born, we have the same obligation to act ethically toward
them as we do towards everyone else. This is not changed by the fact that the
individual would have never been born in the first place without our intervention.
[...]
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
If that>s the way you feel, then you should be opposed to what you suggested
above. Already it is being shown that you>re not in favor of what you suggested
at all.
All of us will be killed by something. Many wild animals live shorter lives than
many domestic ones. The lives of the animals are more significant than their deaths,
and that is true for every one of us...including animals raised for food. So far no one
has given me good reason to think of domestic animals and wildlife in different ways.
Some of them have decent lives and some of them don>t. You might just as well
suggest that we eliminate wild rabbits so they aren>t killed by predators, as suggest
we eliminate broiler chickens so they aren>t killed by humans. Battery chickens are
a different issue imo, and I would support their elimination.

Jill · Guest

wafflycat wrote:
[quote]" Jill" <news@NOSPAMkintaline.co.uk> wrote in message
news:6bnfdqF3chb5eU1@mid.individual.net...
Amy Blankenship wrote:
.

Probably if you could ask most of these hens, they>d prefer
continued life, despite the risks, to the alternative...

That depends on the stress factors?
A clean death is better than a lingering one.
And hens are not capable of knowing that there are the alternatives,
only the humans are.
;)

And a good job too, as over 80,000 ex-batts have been given a second
chance due to the work of the Battery Hen Welfare Trust.
[/quote]
well their asset register will be even more improved from the nearly £40k
they had accrued by the end of 2006, but they have not yet registered their
2007 accounts.

The problem that needs to be addressed is not the battery system as such. We
DO need to make sure that inspections are fully funded and frequently
executed to make sure that only the best are operating.
What is the greater problem is the food demand of the humans.
The reason d>etre of the battery system is that to produce eggs in the
quantities required by the ever increasing and demanding population, the
free range flock could not cope.
It could not cope in the 1950>s and certainly will never cope in this
millennia.

Battery systems occured before the turn of the previous millennia, their
advantages and their problems were already known.
As the population of humans increased so did the demand for food. Food like
eggs and milk are non-negotiable, they are not something that is a
uxury -- they have to be a staple for basic good health.
The poultry industry did its best to maintain productivity and animal health
while meeting the rapidly increasing demand but it was a losing battle. The
free range flocks were getting sicker with the demands put on them. This, in
turn, lead to human health issues.
Bringing them indoors, in vast systems, allowed the intensification of
selection to take place. Millions of birds were brought indoors and the
strains were cleaned up of many of the disease vectors that damaged the
birds health and the human health. The exercise was colossal :- testing,
culling, breeding, observations, research on feed - At the same time
breeding for desirable traits - productivity and efficiency - was able to be
moved along at an amazing pace.
All of this was to answer the need for food. and food that people could
afford.

Nowadays we have a generally affluent society, but we are not all so lucky.
Food still needs to be affordable for even the least fortunate.
More importantly we now have even more and more humans. The volume of demand
for a basic product like eggs is quite staggering.
The industry does its best to supply, but here in the UK we started
importing eggs in the mid 1800>s and we import millions each year now.

There are 41 million birds [or more] inside producing eggs for the humans of
the UK at any one time.
These birds are athletes - precision genetics for the role they play in our
lives.
As long as the unit is well run, they are given a stable environment, where
there is no consideration of heat, cold, snow, rain, wind, wild birds
passing on disease, predators, variations in food, winter, bullying from
other birds, and all the rest that our ranging birds have to take on and
survive. This allows the birds to concentrate their resources on one
thing --- laying eggs.
The cage system maintains a status quo between the birds, allows for the
best feed input and the cleanest egg output.
Eggs are no longer the dangerous food they once were [and I mean well before
ms Edwina!], they are a clean, safe, easy and readily available food, as
they should be.
A well run system has low veterinary input - - these are unwelcome costs.

I completely endorse very stringent checking and lots of constant training
for the people in charge of these units. I know the system can be abused.
But not all units are. They should not all be condemned.

As to having all birds outside
-- its a far more challenging environment - for the birds and their health
and to protect human health.
-- we simply do not have enough suitable land in this country for the hens
we would need to put outside, - its either too wet, too windy, too built
on, too poorly drained, too many predators. Global warming is creating a far
more volatile climate in the UK -- if the areas of England that were flooded
crops last summer had been free ranging birds then millions could have been
drowned. The forecasters indicate that this is something to get used to.
-- we would need to create birds with different qualities which would
detract from productivity and food efficiency, it can be done but needs time
again to bring these features to the fore, not to put birds that are
designed to be protected, out there.
-- routine mortality is higher outside than in. I completely understand that
if you get a problem inside then the trouble will spread with much greater
efficacy and effect. But it can also be contained.
The most serious problems with H5N1 around the world have been in places
where the containment was not possible due to volume of birds outside.
-- to make economic sense free range units have to be so big that they are
not really free range at all -- they are vast barn units where only a small
proportion of the birds bother to go outside. The potential for bullying and
cannabalism is off the scale. Chickens are just like that in numbers.

I do not think that battery units are anywhere near a perfect answer, fewer
humans would be. But, as that is not going to happen; they have to be fed.

I am really glad that there are people who can afford to choose to buy from
small free range places, but even those people are still buying quite a lot
of battery produced eggs in all the other foods they eat. Egg is in SO Much
as a process ingredient. Its such an important item.
I am really glad that there are people exploring the potential of growing
more food themselves -- fruit, vegetables and having chickens and ducks
themselves. Particularly for the next generation who were in danger of
losing contact with the land that supports them.
I am completely realistic in understanding that this is not going to sustain
the whole population and nor should it.

Putting a few of these birds through the chaos of mixing them up with new
birds, when they have been in settled sets for 2 years; driving them for
hours around the country; handing them out to complete novices with
superficial support; and to the vagaries of the outside environment, poor
diet and all the hazards; particularly with the weakness of immune system
and conditions that the next years will bring on; collecting monies in
return; is not necessarily the most humane solution, in my view. I respect
that your view is different. All I ask is that you respect mine. I have, and
do think about this quite deeply. I help with the aftermath on a daily
basis.

If someone wants to have cheap birds from the commercial world, why not take
birds from free range units, where at least they have had a chance to
develop a decent immune system, and a little savvy about having lots of
"mates" and maybe have been outside a few times. These places also
displenish at a similar age, and are more likely to be closer to hand. By
visiting the local farmers markets and looking at eggs boxes in local shops
its possible to find places in your vicinity. One can choose places where
the flocks are smaller and so more likely to have spent more time outside,
these will be so much more robust and happy to deal with the conditions.
They are also being culled, why not re-home them?

Even better get birds who are really suited to the job you want them to
perform and encourage some of the supreme excellence in breeding that this
country was once famous for.
We are so in danger of losing all the best qualities of the birds we once
had, there are Victorian breeders spinning in their graves to see the
wastage and the dross that is being produced in their names.

--
regards
Jill Bowis

Domestic Poultry and Waterfowl Solutions
Herbaceous; Herb and Alpine Nursery
Seasonal Farm Food
http://www.kintaline.co.uk


www.GetXFactor.com Leading Technology, Science, Agriculture News and information	Part of the Identityscape.com network... getxfactor.com jmoodmusic.com smartbusinesschoices.com mintdepot.com lowfaresalways.com evangelicalview.com shoppingpodder.com soproudlywehail.com webnews.ws currenthumor.com

Science and Technology news... Forum Index -> Agriculture - Poultry Forum	Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3 ... 13, 14, 15, 16 Next
Page 14 of 16