Science and Technology news... :: View topic - Was there a civilization that existed 13 000 years ago?

Dwight E. Howell · Guest

Daryl Krupa wrote:
[quote]On Jun 9, 6:30 pm, "Dwight E. Howell" <deo...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
snip
There are a series of stories about Noah. The oldest was about a ruler
who was on his ark when a huge flood came along and washed him
away from his mooring. Eventually they ended up grounding.
He and his family settled in at the new location. The people back
home were angry because they>d lost money some way on a deal
Noah was running though I don>t see that he was at fault. His ark
could best be described as a river barge.
Nothing about everybody drowning either.
snip

Dwight, where can I read more about these older versions of
the Noachian flood myth?

Thanx,
Daryl Krupa
[/quote]

I used to be one of the smucks that bought various Time Life series of
books and this was in one about the middle east. The had a TV special
about the same topic. I think I>ve come across it a few more times in
other places. Try an on line search about Sumerian myths.

I like the Epic of Gilgamesh.

Dwight E. Howell · Guest

Lee Olsen wrote:
[quote]On Jun 9, 6:57 pm, rmacfarl <rmacf...@alphalink.com.au> wrote:
On Jun 10, 1:09 am, Lee Olsen <paleoc...@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Jun 9, 2:05 am, rmacfarl <rmacf...@alphalink.com.au> wrote:
On Jun 9, 3:44 pm, Lee Olsen <paleoc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lee, how about I start where you finished, because you are seriously
confused about my argument.
I can>t be confused about your argument because you don>t have one.
You error is in thinking Warner was wrong, he is not.
Specifically, your comment that you "still want to know why bipedalism
and brain growth had to be synchronous as [I] seemed to imply".
That is the complete, diametric opposite of what I>m arguing.
I don>t care how you moved the goal posts later, I answered to this
erroneous statement:
Ross: "Nice hypothesis, if not for the fact that origin of bipedalism
and
brain growth are separated temporally by 2 or 3 million years..."

Prove it.

My argument is that there is not a link between the origin of
bipedalism and brain growth.

Prove it.

There isn>t if you confuse the type of bipedalism involved, the
"origin" of A>pith bipedalism has nothing to do with
humans, which is what Warner was referring to, since humans were the
only ones who evolved the larger brain.
And I have pointed out that a temporal gap is not a problem, which you
claimed
is a problem and it is not, particularly when you inflate the numbers
to "2 or 3 million years"
which you can>t prove is correct, murky as things are.
That>s not the same as that there couldn>t be a link. Just that there
wasn>t.
Yes there is, there is a link were "humans" are involved, there is not
where A>piths are involved.
Ross: "Nice hypothesis, if not for the fact that origin of bipedalism
and
brain growth are separated temporally by 2 or 3 million years..."

Prove it.

The problem is in the type of bipedalism. Just to say the word
bipedalism is NOT GOOD ENOUGH. It is overly
simplistic. Even Marc understands this: " Well, that depends on the
definition of "bipedalism".
No, the problem is that I keep trying to base my comments on the
substance of the original article, which was the context of my
original comment to Jerry, & in which context my comment was accurate.

No, you keep saying over and over it was, but other than you saying
so,
you have cited anything but yourself.

You keep trying to move the goalposts forward a few million years, and
arguing about events that don>t relate to the original article, nor to
my comment on it.

Because that is were the correlation is between brain growth and
bipedalism.
And the reason is your and the paper is not correct is the fact they
and you can>t recognize this.

If Jerry was commenting about the transition from a>pith(-like?) to
Homo, his comment would not be inaccurate. In the article>s context of
the origin of bipedalism, it is inaccurate.

No one can agree with when this happened, so by using any time scale
makes
your comment wrong. You are assuming something that hasn>t been
demonstrated.

For all you know, bipedalisn evolved twice, same as has been suggested
for knucklewalking.

On Jun 8, 9:15 pm, rmacfarl <rmacf...@alphalink.com.au> wrote:
On Jun 9, 1:15 pm, Lee Olsen <paleoc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Jun 7, 10:14 pm, rmacfarl <rmacf...@alphalink.com.au> wrote:
I put it to you that ape-like hominds with chimp-sized brains evolved
bipedalism millions of years before bipedal hominids evolved large
brains. Nothing you>ve cited so far contradicts that.
No, that wasn>t what you claimed and that wasn>t what I answered to.
It was what I claimed, you just chose to reinterpret it,
No, you chose to move the goal posts from your original statement,
after I had replied.
No, I did not move the goalposts. You misunderstood me.
Please don>t try to tell me that what I have told you is what I meant,
is not what I have meant, because the implication of that is that I>m
lying, which I am not.
I>m not calling you a liar, you are just being overly simplistic about
using the word bipedalism.
A>piths are not the same. The "origin" of it has no meaning in what
Warner claimed. Only larger brains are associated with humans and our
endurat bipedalim, so a gap in what A>piths were doing and it>s origin
is irrelevant to larger brains. If A>piths were the ony creatures
involved, I would agree with you.
So agree with me then. The article refers to the origin of bipedalism
("sometime between four and seven million years ago").

Yep, so you are basing your claim to Warner on a bogas assumption.

That>s why it
talks about "shuffling". It is in fact talking about the precursors of
both a>pith & Homo.

So how do they know that and why do you agree with them.

I am not arguing against the link between Homo bipedalism & brain
growth. But Jerry>s comment, if taken in context of the article, was
1. We don>t have a clue how often bipidalism arouse in apes. If you dig[/quote]
around you will find out that their is/was a subset of chimps that
normally preferred to walk on their hind legs. The reason seems to have
been as simple as mutation/variation that allowed them to completely
straighten their legs.

2. We know that bipids were around for a heck of a long time before
bigger brains showed up in fact habilis doesn>t have much of an expanded
brain, neither do the people from Georgia nor seemingly flores people.
Habilis was a good/decent walker (legs to short) but not much of a
runner or so I have read. Brain size varied a lot depending on what
might or might not be habilis.

3. Longer legs and the ability to run/jog well seems to have shown up
with erectus but the oldest erectus have less than massive brains though
brain size increased through time. A lot of time, however early erectus
seems to have been at least a good a biped as we are and maybe better.

If Lee wants to go somewhere else with this he>s pushing his own theory
or at least he isn>t in the mainstream.

Looks like he is now using nut nick methods to get an argument up and
going so good luck to anybody that wants to horn in.

[quote]erroneous as it would imply that that early bipedal energy benefit
would lead to brain growth.

You are ignoring the 'lag time' possibility again. As soon as you set
a time frame,
you put in numbers that you can>t demonstrate. So you statement has to
be wrong.

& then to
ignore my repeated attempts to explain that to you.
No I didn>t, I just answered you.
What answer did you give, and most importantly, what did you think the
question was?
What was said was:
jerry warner wrote:
freeing energy could divert energy to brain growth.
a win win situation
Ross: "Nice hypothesis, if not for the fact that origin of
bipedalism and brain
growth are separated temporally by 2 or 3 million years..."
What makes you think the shuffling bipedalism was efficient enough
to trigger brain growth "between four and seven million years ago"?
To borrow a phrase, "I>m not suggesting anything, I>m citing others."
So was I in my first reply.
Yeah, but the information I was citing was in context to the
discussion.
No, you are still confused, see contemporary A>piths below.
No, you are confused about my argument, and I disagree with your
analysis re a>piths & Homo below.

Well, then we will just have to stay in disagreement until you come up
with something besides assumptions to support your claim.

Ross: "Nice hypothesis, if not for the fact that origin of bipedalism
and brain growth are separated temporally by 2 or 3 million years..."

Snip[/quote]

Dwight E. Howell · Guest

Lee Olsen wrote:
[quote]On Jun 9, 11:17 pm, rmacfarl <rmacf...@alphalink.com.au> wrote:
On Jun 10, 12:31 pm, Lee Olsen <paleoc...@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Jun 9, 6:57 pm, rmacfarl <rmacf...@alphalink.com.au> wrote:
...
Ross: "Nice hypothesis, if not for the fact that origin of
bipedalism and brain growth are separated temporally
by 2 or 3 million years..."
Prove it.
Already did. Prove me wrong.

Sorry, you didn>t prove anything.

I>ll try again, just for you.

Warner: "freeing energy could divert energy to brain growth.
a win win situation"

Key word "could" and he made no claim as to how much growth or when.

Since we have the atomic bomb and chimps don>t, any amount of brain
growth difference may have led 'initially' to our compeditive edge,
just as a little extra "shuffle" supposedly led to our bipedal edge.

Deffinition of brain growth =s bb in a boxcar (pun) up to the point in
the fossil record where we can actually measure the amount of growth
in some fossil that is human.
Nobody claimed it happened all at once, it>s called evolution.

Did Warner make any claim as to what the size of this-competive edge
larger brain might be? NO.

You are claiming you are simply following the "context" of the
article.
So if they are wrong, you are wrong. Equals are equals, OK?
If the article claimed the earth is flat and you lecture Warner about
being wrong on this basis claiming it was in the "context" of the
article, then you couldn>t possibly be right if they aren>t.

You and the article have made arbitrary and capricious restictions on
time:
Article: "between four and seven million years ago"
Ross: "origin of bipedalism and brain growth are separated temporally
by 2 or 3 million years..."

You don>t know where either one (endurant) started in humans. I read
the article right. As soon as the article mentioned the word "humans"
they were acknowledging differences that they don>t have a clue
("murky") when either brain growth or endurant bipedalism started in
that direct line.

You claim to be following the context of the article, yet the article
didn>t make any such claim "by 2 or 3 million" you did that.

I think you are confusing initial brain growth with "big" brains, like
as to when they can be measured in the fossil record. Well, if you
don>t have any fossils on the human ancestor side to measure, how are
you going to prove bipedalism came millions of years before an
increase in brain size? And I>m NOT holding you to an exact number,
you can retract any part of 3 million you like. You can>t prove WHEN
the initial brain growth started, nobody can. Nor can you falsify
Warner>s claim that the exta energy went into brain growth.

snip
No one can agree with when this happened, so by using any
time scale makes
your comment wrong. You are assuming something that hasn>t been
demonstrated.
False. It had clearly happened by the time of Australopithecus'
evolution - in other words by 4 MYA.

Yep, but what you can>t tell is when the initial brain growth started
in the line that led directly to us humans. The only thing you know
about any particular
A>pith is it didn>t have bipedalism like us and it>s brain didn>t grow
through time.

So on the basis of what *didn>t* happen in any one particular A>pith
you are claiming you know when brain growth started in humans?????

Would not want to prove any of those based on the very incomplete fossil[/quote]
record. That most recent A>pith had a 500 cc brain as I recall. I think
some of them had longer legs than some habilis depending on who decides
what a habilis is that is.

[quote]snip> I will answer the rest of the snipped questions when we get
your first errors fixed.

[/quote]

Dwight E. Howell · Guest

Claudius Denk wrote:
[quote]On Jun 9, 2:49 pm, Marc Verhaegen <m_verhae...@skynet.be> wrote:
Did Humans Colonize the World by Boat?

Research suggests our ancestors traveled the oceans 70,000 years ago.

http://discovermagazine.com/2008/jun/20-did-humans-colonize-the-world...
t

If humans were truly aquatic would they need boats?
[/quote]
No. Not to get from point a to point b. Kind of hard to carry a hand ax
and swim and I seem to recall that the oldest hand axes on Flores were
made of material not found on Flores. A kind of chert.

Dwight E. Howell · Guest

Lee Olsen wrote:
[quote]On Jun 11, 11:42 am, Marc Verhaegen <m_verhae...@skynet.be> wrote:
Chimpanzee-produced stone assemblages from the tropical forests of Taï,
Côte d>Ivoire
J Mercader, M Panger & C Boesch 2002
snip

The artifactual evidence
comprises 479 artifacts and includes stone by-products such as flakes,
tabular pieces, edge fragments, shatter, and microdebitage.

Late Pliocene hominid knapping skills: The case of Lokalalei 2C, West
Turkana, Kenya
Anne Delagnes and Hélène Roche
Journal of Human Evolution
Volume 48, Issue 5, May 2005, Page 436
"It is evident that the Plio-Pleistocene hominids responsible for
making these earliest stone assemblages have moved far beyond the
stage of an unintentional production of dibris such as that resulting
from the accidental breakage of hammerstones at the nut-cracking loci
of chimpanzees (Mercader et al., 2002), which should not be mistaken
for intentional flaking. Late Pliocene stone-working is not technology
in its infancy."

Chimpanzee-produced stone assemblages from "Panda 100" resemble some Early
Stone Age industries from East Africa and provide new insights into the
nature of early hominid technology.

"resemble"???
Geofacts, made by natural causes, can also resemble some
Early Stone Age industries from East Africa.

To put it another way this is the stuff that most likely doesn>t ever[/quote]
even get noticed.

Read Toth. I>m not sure he has written anything in years but his work is
still the best I>ve seen on the earliest recognizable stone age. I don>t
seem to recall him getting to carried away about being certain what the
tool makers looked like. We got a lot of tools and not that many hominid
remains.

Dwight E. Howell · Guest

Lee Olsen wrote:
[quote]On Jun 11, 12:04 pm, Marc Verhaegen <m_verhae...@skynet.be> wrote:
OF Huffman & Y Zaim 2003
Mojokerto Delta, East Jawa: Paleoenvironment of Homo modjokertensis
-- First Results
Submitted to Journal of Mineral Technology, v.10, n. 2. The Faculty of Earth
Sciences and Mineral Technology,
Institute Technology, Bandung.
Mojokerto Delta, East Jawa:
Paleoenvironment of Homo modjokertensis--First Results

"Test excavations at the hominid site during 2001 and 2002 field
seasons produced 250 fossil
vertebrates. The nature of the recovery suggests that additional
hominid remains may be found in the bed.
Fossils from the excavations and nearby surface collecting suggest
that deer, muntjak, bovids, pig,
hippopotamus, rhinoceros, Stegodon, and large cat inhabited the delta,
together with Homo erectus.

The delta plain included--and perhaps was largely covered with--
grasslands. Stable-carbon isotope signatures ($B&D(B13C)
have been obtained from the enamel of teeth of bovids, cervids, and
other animals from the hominid bed and
other localities in the hominid-bearing sequence in the Perning
district. This is the first use the stable-isotope
method to characterize the paleoenvironment of Homo erectus in Jawa.
The results encourage the more
widespread use of the technique. Most of the carbon isotope results
fit the C4 photosynthetic pathway characteristic of tropical grasses."

C4 tropical grasses, large cats. IOW, for all practical purposes, most
of the same
types of animals one would find on an African savanna.

Thanks Marc for the savanna confirmation.

Now, could you please tell us how cheetahs and He got to China?

http://www.cheetahssp.org/
"Cheetahs are adapted for life on grassy plains or savannas but also
make
extensive use of bush, scrub and open woodlands."

"Cheetahs are well-adapted to living in arid environments and are not
obligate drinkers.
They appear able to satisfy their moisture requirements from their
prey''s blood and urine or by eating tsama melons."

"Their remains have been found in Europe, India and China. A more
recent
but slightly smaller cheetah, Acinonyx intermedius, evolved during
the
mid-Pleistocene period (3.8 to 1.9 million years ago) and extended its
range into China."

[/quote]
They have also been found in North America. The genetic studies say they
are most closely related to the American mountain lion/cougar/ whatever.

Dwight E. Howell · Guest

Marc Verhaegen wrote:
[quote]SF:
No doubt wetape loons think rhinos live in mangrove swamps.

My little boy, there are 5 spp of rhino, 3 are semi-aquatic.

Java is part of mainland Asia during ice ages.[/quote]

Dwight E. Howell · Guest

Cory Albrecht wrote:
[quote]jonatthehelm@gmail.com wrote:
In Japan, there is one girl, who looks twenty eight or nine, who is
over three hundred years old, and one guy, who looks in his fifties or
so, who is over twelve hundred years old. Some islanders, a few, are
around four hundred years old. The Japanese government knows about
them, but doesn>t say any thing about them. They all eat healthful
diets. The two persons I mentioned experiment with mountain herbals of
the psychotropic kind, along with marijuana in their diet and with
marijuana as a type of herbal brew, like Absinthe, with other plants,
such as hallucinogenic mushrooms, and tiny animals, such as

You, my friend are overly credulous. Or perhaps you>ve been
experimenting with a few of these "herbs"?
[/quote]

The oldest person on the planet died recently. It made the news. 115 and
her brain was in good shape. I think Scandinavian?

Cory Albrecht · Guest

Dwight E. Howell wrote:
[quote]Cory Albrecht wrote:
jonatthehelm@gmail.com wrote:
In Japan, there is one girl, who looks twenty eight or nine, who is
over three hundred years old, and one guy, who looks in his fifties or
so, who is over twelve hundred years old. Some islanders, a few, are
around four hundred years old. The Japanese government knows about
them, but doesn>t say any thing about them. They all eat healthful
diets. The two persons I mentioned experiment with mountain herbals of
the psychotropic kind, along with marijuana in their diet and with
marijuana as a type of herbal brew, like Absinthe, with other plants,
such as hallucinogenic mushrooms, and tiny animals, such as

You, my friend are overly credulous. Or perhaps you>ve been
experimenting with a few of these "herbs"?

The oldest person on the planet died recently. It made the news. 115 and
her brain was in good shape. I think Scandinavian?
[/quote]
Edna Parker of Indiana, USA, born 20 April 1893, is currently the oldest
living person. She becae the oldest living person when Yone Minigawa of
Fukuoka Prefecture, Japan died on 13 August 2007 at age 114, 7 months
and 9 days. The only Scandinavan to hold the title of oldest living
person was Lovisa Svensson of Sweden who died in 1963 at age 109, 2
months and 28 days.

The longest unambiguously documented lifespan is that of Jeanne Calment
of France (1875â€“1997), who died aged 122 years and 164 days.

In any case, that>s an order of magnitude *less* than Jonatthehelm>s
claim of "ne guy, who looks in his fifties or so, who is over twelve
hundred years old".

Rick Wagler · Guest

"Dwight E. Howell" <deowll@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:MgG7k.12799$s77.1272@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
[quote]Marc Verhaegen wrote:
SF:
No doubt wetape loons think rhinos live in mangrove swamps.

My little boy, there are 5 spp of rhino, 3 are semi-aquatic.
Java is part of mainland Asia during ice ages.
[/quote]
Another point to consider. The three relict populations
of Asian rhino species are confined to inaccessible swamps.
It would be interesting to see what the original ecological
breadth of the historical distribution of these species is.

Rick Wagler

Rick Wagler · Guest

"Cory Albrecht" <coryalbrecht@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:hrq3j5x67n.ln2@xanadu.fenris.cjb.net...
Dwight E. Howell wrote:
[quote]Cory Albrecht wrote:
jonatthehelm@gmail.com wrote:
In Japan, there is one girl, who looks twenty eight or nine, who is
over three hundred years old, and one guy, who looks in his fifties or
so, who is over twelve hundred years old. Some islanders, a few, are
around four hundred years old. The Japanese government knows about
them, but doesn>t say any thing about them. They all eat healthful
diets. The two persons I mentioned experiment with mountain herbals of
the psychotropic kind, along with marijuana in their diet and with
marijuana as a type of herbal brew, like Absinthe, with other plants,
such as hallucinogenic mushrooms, and tiny animals, such as

You, my friend are overly credulous. Or perhaps you>ve been
experimenting with a few of these "herbs"?

The oldest person on the planet died recently. It made the news. 115 and
her brain was in good shape. I think Scandinavian?
[/quote]
Edna Parker of Indiana, USA, born 20 April 1893, is currently the oldest
living person. She becae the oldest living person when Yone Minigawa of
Fukuoka Prefecture, Japan died on 13 August 2007 at age 114, 7 months
and 9 days. The only Scandinavan to hold the title of oldest living
person was Lovisa Svensson of Sweden who died in 1963 at age 109, 2
months and 28 days.

The longest unambiguously documented lifespan is that of Jeanne Calment
of France (1875-1997), who died aged 122 years and 164 days.

In any case, that>s an order of magnitude *less* than Jonatthehelm>s
claim of "ne guy, who looks in his fifties or so, who is over twelve
hundred years old".

* For heaven>s sake don>t tell him about that valley in
* the Hindu Kush.....

Rick Wagler

Dwight E. Howell · Guest

Daryl Krupa wrote:
[quote]On Jun 22, 10:27 pm, "Dwight E. Howell" <deo...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
Daryl Krupa wrote:
On Jun 9, 6:30 pm, "Dwight E. Howell" <deo...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
snip
There are a series of stories about Noah. The oldest was about a ruler
who was on his ark when a huge flood came along and washed him
away from his mooring. Eventually they ended up grounding.
He and his family settled in at the new location. The people back
home were angry because they>d lost money some way on a deal
Noah was running though I don>t see that he was at fault. His ark
could best be described as a river barge.
Nothing about everybody drowning either.
snip
Dwight, where can I read more about these older versions of
the Noachian flood myth?
Thanx,
Daryl Krupa
I used to be one of the smucks that bought various Time Life series of
books and this was in one about the middle east. The had a TV special
about the same topic. I think I>ve come across it a few more times in
other places. Try an on line search about Sumerian myths.

I like the Epic of Gilgamesh.

I like "the Adventures of Hucklberry Finn", myself,
which has a ruler who was on his watercraft when a flood
came along and washed him away from his mooring.
Eventually they ended up grounding.
He and his Court settled in at the new location.
The people there were angry because they>d lost money
some way on a dealthat the ruler was running, and they
tarred and featherd him and ran him out of town on a rail.
His ark could best be described as a river raft.
Is that one of the other paces that you saw that story?

- Daryl Krupa
[/quote]
Playing the troll again and just boring as bleep at it. I have the
compiled works of Samuel Clemens and he is much more fun to read than
anything you have ever written. Even his fiction is a lot more factual
than anything you have ever tried to pass of as fact including facts.
You can turn even the most mundane and widely accepted data into total
gibberish. No doubt it>s a gift. If anybody believed you other than your
own kind you would be dangerous.

Have fun and may God bless and keep you or whatever.

utternoncents · Guest

On Jun 19, 8:56 pm, jonattheh...@gmail.com wrote:
[quote]What plants or herbs are there, do you think, that will aide the human
body to regrow itself? There must be some plants out there, that
assist the function of the human body to repair itself. I wonder what
those plants are.

Perrenial youth is the agenda here, and it would seem that plants that
appeal them selves to us, as perrenially youthful, in some remarkable
way that is noticable by us, might be the advertizing sign display, of
plants, as they communicate to humans, that, this is what they are
useful for.

I would guess that there is some extract that can be made from some of
these plants, that would assist the human body in rebuilding itself.
We have a rudimentary repair system, just as all animals do, and cuts
heal, skin repairs itself, finger nails and toe nails, and hair
continue to grow, skin grows and replaces itself, organs grow and
replace themselves, and even teeth grow, and replace themselves,
though it is not noticeable to us.

These processes, many of course, have noticed and commented on, and
there are probably lots of scientific research and analysis into it.
But the question still remains. Where in the plant world, will we find
plants that come to our aide to give us what we need, to rejuvenate
the human body.

We find plants that provide us with many things, besides food, of
course. Opium poppy flowers, and prickley lettuce plants, and possibly
other plants, exude latex gums that have opiates in them, or chemicals
similar to opiates, that help us with our needs to fight off pains in
our bodies. It seems there is an intelligence in the plants, an
intuitive intelligence, and that intelligence led to the development
of the latex gums liquids that assist humans in their needs for
finding ways to cope with pains in their bodies.

There must be intuitive intelligence in plants that developed plant
chemicals that assist the human body with regeneration of body parts,
for example, and with rejuvenation of the human body.

What research is there, that we can learn about, that will assist us
in understanding what these plants are, that intuitively developed
chemicals that allow the human body to more robustly regenerate
itself, and rejuvenate itself.

Not only humans need to regenerate and rejuvenate themselves, but all
animals need to, so it is a high level agenda, you would think, or a
priority issue, that plants long ago, must have picked up on, and
developed in their tiny laboratories, inside their stalks, roots,
branches, flowers, and leaves.

There must be lots of indigenous people in America, and in other
countries of the world, who noticed these things, and kept
information, orally, or otherwise, on what plants were good for what
purposes.

I think this body of information, probably exists in various forms,
texts, computer databases, and so forth, and is held or kept by
individuals who do not wish to share it with others.

It is one of these areas where people are trying to use the
information for making a buck, at the expense of other people, who
have a right to learn about this information.

This kind of information probably exists in all the countries on our
planet, and it is held by handfuls of people, who do not care about
the needs of the ordinary people.

I think this information must be shared with all the people of this
planet, who can access it, via computer, or library, or educational
institution, etc., as it is something every one has a right to learn
about.

There must be a lot of this, going on, useful plants information
withheld from others out of greed or stingyness. It>s too bad that we
are the way we are, that there are greedy and stingy people,
interested in making a buck for themselves, and not caring about
others.

In any case, we need to learn about plants and their use for assisting
the human bodies' repair systems. It>s strange that there is this body
of knowledge, but it is not available to the ordinary people. We are
being cheated here, which is understandable, just as there are people
who go out into the coastal waters off the Bahamas, or Florida, or
Cuba, and so forth, looking for gold for self profit, there are people
who have this information, who are only interested in using it for
gaining self profit.

If this information were to be turned over to all people on this
planet, it would assist in our evolutionary development as a species
of animals, living in harmony with our environment.

It>s too bad we are not given the opportunity to exploit fully, all
that there is to know and use for the purpose of healing our bodies,
and for regenerating them, and making them as good as new, again.

One day, we>ll have this information, but it won>t come, any time
soon, with out a struggle with the people who possess it and who do
not wish to share it with others.

We all have in us, tiny organs that help with the repair of our
bodies, such as when we get cuts, or scrapes, or broken bones, our
bodies go to work inside, fixing and repairing the damages. I>m pretty
sure we have dedicated organs in our bodies, though they may not be
all that well developed, at this point in time, due to our early
evolutionary status, but with the help of plants toxins, we can
nurture these organs on, and assist them in doing their jobs, and we
might find that we can repair teeth, finger nails, toe nails, skin,
and hair with the assistance of their chemicals, not to mention, the
organs in our bodies.

It seems to me, we need to get this information, and make it available
to all people. This will help us in our efforts to move forward, along
with the plant world, evolutionarily speaking.

That the U.S. government, or other governments, or the DEA, or the
FDA, or the FBI, would interfere with our experimentation with plants,
in our efforts to find plants that will assist us in our needs for
evolutionary development, seems a crime, to me. If we need to
experiment with psychotropic plants, plants that cause hallucinations,
or plants that cause euphoria, or a mental high, then we have the
right to experiment with them, if these plants show promise to us that
they may assist our bodies, in regenerating themselves.

Youthful exuberance, or the willingness to play, among children, if we
look at this, and then if we compare the plants we know about, that
give us euphoric highs, maybe there in, is a clue to us, that we are
over looking. Maybe that clue is saying, here is a plant, that allows
you to be perpetually young in spirit. Just smoke some of it, or make
a beverage of it, and see for your self, what this plant will do for
you. Oh, and by the way, this plant contains chemicals with properties
that will assist the human body to regenerate it self. Here in, may be
a key, or a code signal from the plant world to us. Plants that allow
us to enjoy sillyness, may in fact be these types of plants that will
assist the body to regenerate themselves, so that we can be
perpetually youthful, in body and in mind. I think we need to look
into this, more closely. Even though the FDA, and the DEA state there
are no good medical uses for these types of plants, perhaps they are
wrong, in that they have over looked an important area of human health
and development, the need to regenerate the human body and brain.

Jonjon
[/quote]
Google > Mangostein, that>s your answer.

utternoncents · Guest

On Jun 19, 7:27 pm, jonattheh...@gmail.com wrote:
[quote]What are the problems with the human races?

Prior to our becoming civilized, we were part of a vigorous
evolutionary development program, that involved apes promiscuously
sexing, along the equatorial warm tropical coasts on all of the
continents of this planet.

We are not the children of Abraham, or whoever, as some misguided
religionists types might want you to believe. We did not evolve from
one "lucy", as some misguided anthropologists might want to have you
believe.

We evolved vigorously, so rapidly, we are at a point in time now,
where we are still trying to understand what it is we are.

Unfortunately, we have the dogmas of the monotheistic big three,
Christianity, Judaism, and Islam, not to mention, Brahmanism,
Zorastrianism, and possibly others that believe in an absolutist
creator god, hampering us.

We don>t realize it, but we were in a race with other animals, to see
who would evolve, first, as a life form with higher intelligence. I
think we can say, we beat every one else, that is, all of the animals
on this planet, and we came out, way ahead of every other animal on
this planet.

The trouble is, now, these religions we developed interfere with our
lives. I>ve explained already, that these religions are operating in
such a way as to hinder our evolutionary progress.

If we let them hinder us, we can not continue to develope ourselves as
an evolving species, to any remarkable extent. I think it is in our
interests to understand that our salvation lies not in religion, and
not in some life after death, but in evolution.

We can evolve into higher and higher life forms, that one day, will be
so advanced, our bodies will repair themselves from the wear and tear
of daily living. That means, when our teeth get chipped, or worn down,
they will automatcially regrow. When our bones deteriorate, they will
regrow. When our skin ages, it will rejuvenate itself, and regain a
youthful appearance. Our bodies will be able to handle all the wear
and tear on it, and reqrow, and replace the cells that are needed, to
continue on, with a youthful appearance and youthful health. Age and
aging will become a non issue, once we reach this level of
evolutionary development. We will, in essence, stop aging, and we will
remain youthful, and healthy. This is the next stop on the ride to
evolutionary development. We have evolved intelligence. Now, we need
to evolve, perpetuity of the species. Once we reach that level of
evolutionary development, perpetuity, then, life gets interesting, for
all.

There are people in our universe, who have evolved to that point.
There are people who evolved to that level of physical endurance, life
and living perpetually, and they do not age, and their bodies repair
themselves. They have organs in their bodies, that evolved, that
handle all the repair operations.

In our bodies, we have proccesses that occur, that repair every day,
scrapes, scratches, cuts to the skin, chipped bones, broken bones, and
so forth. But this is part of a rudimentary repair system that all
animals have.

Evolutionarily, there are people in our universe, who developed much
more highly sophisticated repair systems, and they virtually do not
need to worry about aging and dying. They stay young, and for many of
them, their bodies regrow.

Yes, some of them reach a point, after many millions or billions of
years, where their bodies can not go on any longer, and their bodies
begin to slow down, and then the repair proccesses shut down.
Environmental radiation, for example, is one reason, the repair
processes of people>s bodies slowly shut down. There are also diseases
that cause this to happen in some people.

These people, who with highly evolved body repair systems, who live
for millions, or billions of years, or perhaps, even longer, they
populate our universe, and live in advanced cultures and societies,
with highly sophisticated technologies to support their existence.

I mentioned, a brain wave frequencies database that has all of the
information in it on everything and on everyone who has ever lived.

There are technologies that can tap into this brain wave frequencies
database, and out of it, they can produce, anything needed.

This sounds impossible, but it is not. They can produce a living
chicken, or a living duck, or a living salmon, or a half dozen rolled
cigars, for that matter.

This type of technology is advanced molecular manipulation technology.
We can call it, particalization technology. There is also,
departicalization technology, that allows people to recycle molecules.

It takes a lot of energy to departicalize an object, but it can be
done with the right technologies. Particalizing something, is far more
difficult, since you can>t particalize something, unless you can get
it imaged, properly. How do you image an object? It takes brain wave
frequencies to image an object, before the object can be particalized.
It is not a difficult process, but we haven>t developed it, as yet. We
don>t even know, or haven>t even discovered that there is a brain wave
frequencies database, where in, we can find every thing needed for
molecularly structuring objects we would like to particalize. If we
don>t know that it exists, how can we experiment with it? We can>t.
But that doesn>t mean, that other civilizations in our universe,
haven>t experimented with it, and solved the problems involved.

Once the technologies are developed, then, there is an unlimited
wealth for food, and resources, right at our finger tips. Once the
technologies are developed, then it is just a matter of supplying the
energies needed to operate the technologies.

We have a lot of brainy people on this planet, but let>s face it, we
don>t know anything about this universe we are living in, and we don>t
have the sciences we need to be able to understand our universe and
the processes involved in it.

We are an evolved species of intelligent beings, but we are not going
anywhere, right now, that is, we are at a standstill, thanks to the
monotheistic big three, as I>ve explained about.

Unless, we continue our evolutionary development on this planet, and
get to the point where are bodies and brains are self perpetuating,
that is, if we don>t get to the point where we have in our bodies, all
the organs that are needed to constantly and continuously rebuild our
bodies and brains, then we have no chance of getting to any level of
living that is above this common, ordinary, dreary, short existence we
are stuck in, that begins as babies, and ends in old age.

It doesn>t matter too much, as we are going to be here, for eternity,
and we come back, again and again, in one life, after the next, and
because as I said, there are people who are in our universe, who did
evolve far enough and who do, as a result, have self perpetuating self
repairing bodies and brains.

But. If we want to move the human race further along evolutionarily
than it is now, we will have to make some changes, in how things are
done.

I have set out some ideas on how we need to change things, to restart
evolutionary development. In light of the need to continue with our
evolutionary development, it would seem wise, to change things,
accordingly.

Jonjon
[/quote]
So ,with no religion, we need no government morals only public
opinion,because there are no right and wrong ,only what you think is
right and what I think is right ,so if enough people, think queer sex
is ok ,and out vote you ,that>s the law, if enough people think
seatbelts are ok ,that>s ok, if enough people smoke with their child
in the car,that>s ok (more people smoke than are Republicans) then
again Jefferson was a Democrat and tobacco grower.If I like your wife
and I take her by force,thank your religious morals based government
for getting her back

Guest

On Jun 22, 11:01 pm, Cory Albrecht <coryalbre...@hotmail.com> wrote:
[quote]Dwight E. Howell wrote:
Cory Albrecht wrote:
jonattheh...@gmail.com wrote:

Edna Parker of Indiana, USA, born 20 April 1893, is currently the oldest
living person. She becae the oldest living person when Yone Minigawa of
Fukuoka Prefecture, Japan died on 13 August 2007 at age 114, 7 months
and 9 days. The only Scandinavan to hold the title of oldest living
person was Lovisa Svensson of Sweden who died in 1963 at age 109, 2
months and 28 days.
[/quote]
My brain showed me these people. That>s all the documentation I need.
My brain and how it functions is far superior to any thing they>ve got
out there, including the hubble telescope and all their space
observatories, and any thing else they>d like to compare, as my brain
can see over the past to the present to the future and is plugged into
the brain waves frequencies database, very actively. You wouldn>t
believe the stuff I>ve seen going on in our universe relayed to my
visual optics nerves by my brain. By the way, my grandma was 114 when
she passed away, a few years ago. That>s nothing. They>ve got
documented cases of older folks in Japan, or they did, when I was over
there. I forget their ages, it>s too common place a thing. Lots of
islanders living on the tiny islands south of Kyushu live a long time.
They attribute their long lives to staying active out in their
gardens, rice paddy fields, and so forth.

Jonjon


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