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Peter Moran · Guest

Bolen is scum. Have you noted that he NEVER presents any information that
might provide a defense for those he supports? He has never once, for
example, ever said that he believes that Hulda Clark>s methods actually
work, or produced any information that supports her work.. He simply
attacks those who think with very good reason that her ideas are nonsense.
I suspect he already knows this.

The present case demonstrates his method..

Kadile is a doctor accused of malpractice in relation to a number of
patients. The details of the actual charges are given here --
..
http://www.quackwatch.org/11Ind/kadile.html

Bolen knows that if he addresses the actual compaints he will quickly get
into indefensible territory, as many of the grounds for malpractice relate
to conventional misgdiagnosis and mistreatments.

SO what does he do.? He resorts to lies, abuse, character assassination and
ridicule. Why should he do otherwise? He writes for the converted, and
they will not bother to check the facts.

As I said, he is scum, and there are only one or two people on this list who
would feel this latest bit of his invective is worthy of repetition.. You
know who they are.

Peter Moran

Tony Bad · Guest

"Peter Moran" <moringa@gil.com.au> wrote in message
news:3effa787_2@news.brisbane.pipenetworks.com...
[quote]
As I said, he is scum, and there are only one or two people on this list who
would feel this latest bit of his invective is worthy of repetition.. You
know who they are.

Peter Moran

The irony is the one who did so is always trumpeting the evil of personal[/quote]
bashing or trashing. I guess all is fair when it is someone you agree with.

T

Joel M. Eichen D.D.S. · Guest

Old story Jan .....

No one here is interested .....

Really ... .this is the dental newsgroup!

On 30 Jun 2003 22:59:35 GMT, jdrew63929@aol.com (Jan) wrote:

[quote]
From: "Tony Bad" SpamSpamSpam@bakedbeans.spam
Date: 6/30/2003 5:25 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <neULa.45808$2D1.14225694@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net

[/quote]
--
Joel M. Eichen, D.D.S.
Philadelphia PA

www.phillyducks.com
We’re Just A Duck Call Away!

STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies ~
meaning no one IN PENNSYLVANIA
has seen the tooth or teeth in
question so take this advice in
proper context ~ its the internet!

We is guessin'!

Joel M. Eichen D.D.S. · Guest

On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 00:49:42 GMT, Peter Bowditch <peterb@ratbags.com>
wrote:

[quote]jdrew63929@aol.com (Jan) wrote:

As long a Baratz is a part of the Barrett team, you don>t even want to know WHY
he is going to court.

He is going to court at the invitation of the state of Wisconsin as an
expert witness. He did not ask to be there - they invited him. The
original expert witness was going to be Dr John Renner, but
unfortunately he died. For Bolen to claim that Dr Baratz is "on trial"
is what is known in technical terms as "a lie".

[/quote]
Wow!

Jan is that so?

--
Joel M. Eichen, D.D.S.
Philadelphia PA

www.phillyducks.com
We’re Just A Duck Call Away!

STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies ~
meaning no one IN PENNSYLVANIA
has seen the tooth or teeth in
question so take this advice in
proper context ~ its the internet!

We is guessin'!

Peter Bowditch · Guest

jdrew63929@aol.com (Jan) wrote:

[quote]As long a Baratz is a part of the Barrett team, you don>t even want to know WHY
he is going to court.
[/quote]
He is going to court at the invitation of the state of Wisconsin as an
expert witness. He did not ask to be there - they invited him. The
original expert witness was going to be Dr John Renner, but
unfortunately he died. For Bolen to claim that Dr Baratz is "on trial"
is what is known in technical terms as "a lie".

Speaking of Bolen, when Dr Renner died Bolen issued one of his rants
to his imaginary "millions of health freedom fighters" headed "Hell
burns a little brighter today". It is instructive that Jan>s obsessive
hatred of Dr Barrett allows her to pass on the lies of Bolen without
ever considering the reputation, morals or motivation. Sad.

--
Peter Bowditch peterb@ratbags.com
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DD · Guest

WubbaBubba wrote:

[quote]On 30 Jun 2003 21:48:45 GMT, mrsralph@aol.com (Mrsralph) wrote:

Are you also in
favor of eliminating all public education, so that education is only
available to families who can afford private education?

Wow, good point!

In fact, yes I do advocate elimination of public education.
Eliminate the school taxes and the government wastefulness
that goes along with it and everyone who wanted to educate
their children privately would be able to do so.

It will not happen though.
[/quote]
You cannot seriously believe this. You>re not a LaRouche guy, are
you?
Even a moment of thinking about this should tell you that the wealthy
would get the best education for their kids (as they do now) and the poor
would get no education.

Steve (not a trickle-down guy)

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001
http://www.dentaltwins.com

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DD · Guest

Mr Puggy wrote:

[quote]Is the treatment any different if you are NHS or private?
[/quote]
Writing from the US:

Dentistry is occasionally as much a dark art as hard science. No
two dentists will necessarily approach the same set of problems in the
same way, whether NHS or private. Having said that, I have heard that
it is likely that for some categories of treatment you may have to wait
for a dentist to perform it under the NHS. There may also be certain
categories of treatment that are unavailable under the NHS. Hopefully
some UK dentist will comment further.

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001
http://www.dentaltwins.com

Krzysztof Polanowski · Guest

right thats right I follow your advice
Uzytkownik "WubbaBubba" <No_1@nowhere.org> napisal w wiadomosci
news:jn33gvkr79a92tbq77sseu6ihd0qvs3st8@4ax.com...
[quote]
AH+ difficult to remove due to it being an epoxy based sealer.

You could try a heated spreader to remove GP and then
freshen the walls of the canal with K files.

You are asking about a re-treatment correct ?

On Tue, 1 Jul 2003 13:01:12 +0200, "Krzysztof Polanowski"
gab.stom@acn.waw.pl> wrote:

ok situation root filled gutapercha and ah plus I can use first post
space
bur next NTI -k3 for exemple next handy tools ,chemical
liquid -chloroform
(english the some) What are you think of it ?
Uzytkownik "Joel M. Eichen D.D.S." <joeleichen@yahoo.com> napisal w
wiadomosci news:ugk2gv8uco2ujmbb9v81q66sgbcvejb880@4ax.com...
Most definitely YES!

On Tue, 1 Jul 2003 08:50:06 +0200, "Krzysztof Polanowski"
gab.stom@acn.waw.pl> wrote:

yes I agreed but there are cases when eno is needed
Uzytkownik "Joel M. Eichen D.D.S." <joeleichen@yahoo.com> napisal w
wiadomosci news:ilf1gvsqte3e7rfgcceahtgbhf4hli6mcq@4ax.com...
Good point!

A dentist after my own liking ~ conservative!

Joel

On Mon, 30 Jun 2003 20:49:58 +0200, "Ernst Baumgartner"
info@prodentesano.ch> wrote:

I am general too, but I AVOID endo as much as I can.
And I am fairly successful at it, my patients have two orders of
magnitude
less dead teeth than my new patients, who have, on average, between
2
and
3
pulps executed.

Dr Ernst Baumgartner

"Krzysztof Polanowski" <gab.stom@acn.waw.pl> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:bdpt62$do0$1@inews.gazeta.pl...
oh I do endo quite ok but I love training more and more and
discuss
differnces in treating
I am general but I do endo,cosmetic ,surgery in some
cases(imnplants
dyna )
and prosthetics,perio
:)))))

--
Joel M. Eichen, D.D.S.
Philadelphia PA

www.phillyducks.com
We>re Just A Duck Call Away!

STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies ~
meaning no one IN PENNSYLVANIA
has seen the tooth or teeth in
question so take this advice in
proper context ~ its the internet!

We is guessin'!

--
Joel M. Eichen, D.D.S.
Philadelphia PA

www.phillyducks.com
We>re Just A Duck Call Away!

STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies ~
meaning no one IN PENNSYLVANIA
has seen the tooth or teeth in
question so take this advice in
proper context ~ its the internet!

We is guessin'!

[/quote]

--
Serwis Usenet w portalu Gazeta.pl -> http://www.gazeta.pl/usenet/

Tony Bad · Guest

"Mrsralph" <mrsralph@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20030630174534.20800.00001738@mb-m27.aol.com...
[quote]Capitalism is the only viable real world model whether you are talking
about aircraft repair, dentistry, or any other business.

But ...
Isn>t it possible to have social programs in a capitalist society?
How viable is our current medical model when many WORKING people can>t afford
care?
[/quote]
It is undoubtedly a problem when people legitimately cannot afford healthcare,
but there are other thoughts to consider. I spent several years working in a
practice where a good number of patients had their care paid for by the state. A
significant number, dare I say the majority, were running a scam of one type or
another. There were children of divorced parents where one of the parents was
not taking financial responsibility for their kids care. Why should that be the
taxpayers burden? The kids own parent wouldn>t pay, but John Q. Public should? I
say track down that parent and squeeze them for the money. Another trick was
that there were many "families" where there was no official marrige, allowing
them to effectively dodge the income requirements and receive assistance based
on one persons income rather then both. There were many others who worked in
trades where they were paid in cash. These people not only didn>t pay taxes, but
they looked poor on paper and were taking advantage of many social programs.
There are others who on one hand will tell me they cannot afford my care, then
tell me about the vacation they took, or the new SUV they just got. I do not
feel I or anyone should tell them how to spend their money, but if they would
rather spend on luxury items then their health, please don>t make it my burden
to take care of them when they are sick. How about people who demand, and
doctors who comply, giving them prescriptions that they don>t need. Or people
who fake illness to take advantage of disability. Years ago, I worked in an
office where many patients worked for a large public utility. It was common
practice to fake an injury, or at least the severity of the injury, and get a
few months off so one could do some work around the house of take an extended
vacation. There are many other instances of fraud and irresponsible behavior
that increase the costs of insurance and healthcare. I bet most of us can think
of a few more.

I know that solving these issues will necessarily solve our healthcare crisis,
but I think that before you come to the healthcare community, and ask them to
make the sacrafices that will be required of a socialized system (see Canada,
where auto-assembly workers make more than physicians), you better fix some
other things first. I remember how it felt when I was a new dentist and I was
doing fillings and extractions on public assistance patients, making $10 for a
filling, or $8 for an extraction and the patient was clearly not deserving of
that assistance. I will not do that again. I give away services to people I find
are truley in need, but I will not treat public assistance patients, as that
system is so over run with fraud it is sickening. If this is an example of what
the government can do, count me out. I>d retire first and open an auto repair
shop.

Okay, done ranting.

T

Tony Bad · Guest

jdrew63929@aol.com (Jan) wrote in message
news:<20030630185935.09515.00003386@mb-m11.aol.com>...
[quote]From: "Tony Bad" SpamSpamSpam@bakedbeans.spam
Date: 6/30/2003 5:25 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <neULa.45808$2D1.14225694@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net

"Peter Moran" <moringa@gil.com.au> wrote in message
news:3effa787_2@news.brisbane.pipenetworks.com...

As I said, he is scum, and there are only one or two people on this list
who
would feel this latest bit of his invective is worthy of repetition.. You
know who they are.

Peter Moran

The irony is the one who did so is always trumpeting the evil of personal
bashing or trashing. I guess all is fair when it is someone you agree with.

T

Once again, as usual, you have no idea what you are talking about.

What you have proven is YOU are guilty of exactly what you accuse me of.

As long a Baratz is a part of the Barrett team, you don>t even want to know
WHY
he is going to court.

As for Peter Moran, (who posted this to the dental group also)

Here is his history.

Do tell us Tony, do you see any of the things Peter couldn>t??

(watch for no reply from Tony, who is a dentist and a member of ye good ole
boy
and girl club)

[/quote]
Here is a reply for Jan...

I have you blocked as you are a waste of time.

This is a good example of why. This wasn>t abot Peter...it was about YOU passing
along a personal attack on someone you fucking hypocrite. Do I "bash" you...sure
I do. You deserve it. You, on the other hand, constantly call other out for
doing so, yet when it works to your benefit, you jump right on the same
bandwagon. That, is what is called being a hypocrite.

I am not a member of any good old boy club. I have the knowledge to tell truth
from fiction. You have clearly demonstrated you do not.

T

Ilena · Guest

Peter Bowditch <peterb@ratbags.com> wrote in message news:<36m1gvsq4o0i5c23re7rsdq7uf4iu5roll@4ax.com>...
[quote]jdrew63929@aol.com (Jan) wrote:

As long a Baratz is a part of the Barrett team, you don>t even want to know WHY
he is going to court.

He is going to court at the invitation of the state of Wisconsin as an
expert witness. He did not ask to be there - they invited him. The
original expert witness was going to be Dr John Renner, but
unfortunately he died.
[/quote]

Baratz took over as King (President of the Health Frauds) when Renner
died ... it makes sense for them to ask his successor who had claimed
to be an "expert."

And from my experience, Quack Baratz will be on trial ... regardless
of who "invited" him ... it appears he accepted the "invitation" as an
"expert."

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DD · Guest

Tony Bad wrote:

[quote]"Mrsralph" <mrsralph@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20030630174534.20800.00001738@mb-m27.aol.com...
Capitalism is the only viable real world model whether you are talking
about aircraft repair, dentistry, or any other business.

But ...
Isn>t it possible to have social programs in a capitalist society?
How viable is our current medical model when many WORKING people can>t afford
care?

It is undoubtedly a problem when people legitimately cannot afford healthcare,
but there are other thoughts to consider. I spent several years working in a
practice where a good number of patients had their care paid for by the state. A
significant number, dare I say the majority, were running a scam of one type or
another. There were children of divorced parents where one of the parents was
not taking financial responsibility for their kids care. Why should that be the
taxpayers burden? The kids own parent wouldn>t pay, but John Q. Public should? I
say track down that parent and squeeze them for the money. Another trick was
that there were many "families" where there was no official marrige, allowing
them to effectively dodge the income requirements and receive assistance based
on one persons income rather then both. There were many others who worked in
trades where they were paid in cash. These people not only didn>t pay taxes, but
they looked poor on paper and were taking advantage of many social programs.
There are others who on one hand will tell me they cannot afford my care, then
tell me about the vacation they took, or the new SUV they just got. I do not
feel I or anyone should tell them how to spend their money, but if they would
rather spend on luxury items then their health, please don>t make it my burden
to take care of them when they are sick. How about people who demand, and
doctors who comply, giving them prescriptions that they don>t need. Or people
who fake illness to take advantage of disability. Years ago, I worked in an
office where many patients worked for a large public utility. It was common
practice to fake an injury, or at least the severity of the injury, and get a
few months off so one could do some work around the house of take an extended
vacation. There are many other instances of fraud and irresponsible behavior
that increase the costs of insurance and healthcare. I bet most of us can think
of a few more.

I know that solving these issues will necessarily solve our healthcare crisis,
but I think that before you come to the healthcare community, and ask them to
make the sacrafices that will be required of a socialized system (see Canada,
where auto-assembly workers make more than physicians), you better fix some
other things first. I remember how it felt when I was a new dentist and I was
doing fillings and extractions on public assistance patients, making $10 for a
filling, or $8 for an extraction and the patient was clearly not deserving of
that assistance. I will not do that again. I give away services to people I find
are truley in need, but I will not treat public assistance patients, as that
system is so over run with fraud it is sickening. If this is an example of what
the government can do, count me out. I>d retire first and open an auto repair
shop.

Okay, done ranting.

T
[/quote]
Don>t you think that running a social welfare system which efficiently ferrets
out fraud and corruption is a separate issue from whether public assistance is
legitimate as a concept?

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001
http://www.dentaltwins.com

Krzysztof Polanowski · Guest

there is my tips if you put one drop of chloroform guttapercha is dissolving
very fast

ah-this is problem :)

U¿ytkownik "Krzysztof Polanowski" <gab.stom@acn.waw.pl> napisa³ w wiadomo¶ci
news:bds8rt$pcr$1@inews.gazeta.pl...
[quote]right thats right I follow your advice
Uzytkownik "WubbaBubba" <No_1@nowhere.org> napisal w wiadomosci
news:jn33gvkr79a92tbq77sseu6ihd0qvs3st8@4ax.com...

AH+ difficult to remove due to it being an epoxy based sealer.

You could try a heated spreader to remove GP and then
freshen the walls of the canal with K files.

You are asking about a re-treatment correct ?

On Tue, 1 Jul 2003 13:01:12 +0200, "Krzysztof Polanowski"
gab.stom@acn.waw.pl> wrote:

ok situation root filled gutapercha and ah plus I can use first post
space
bur next NTI -k3 for exemple next handy tools ,chemical
liquid -chloroform
(english the some) What are you think of it ?
Uzytkownik "Joel M. Eichen D.D.S." <joeleichen@yahoo.com> napisal w
wiadomosci news:ugk2gv8uco2ujmbb9v81q66sgbcvejb880@4ax.com...
Most definitely YES!

On Tue, 1 Jul 2003 08:50:06 +0200, "Krzysztof Polanowski"
gab.stom@acn.waw.pl> wrote:

yes I agreed but there are cases when eno is needed
Uzytkownik "Joel M. Eichen D.D.S." <joeleichen@yahoo.com> napisal w
wiadomosci news:ilf1gvsqte3e7rfgcceahtgbhf4hli6mcq@4ax.com...
Good point!

A dentist after my own liking ~ conservative!

Joel

On Mon, 30 Jun 2003 20:49:58 +0200, "Ernst Baumgartner"
info@prodentesano.ch> wrote:

I am general too, but I AVOID endo as much as I can.
And I am fairly successful at it, my patients have two orders of
magnitude
less dead teeth than my new patients, who have, on average,
between
2
and
3
pulps executed.

Dr Ernst Baumgartner

"Krzysztof Polanowski" <gab.stom@acn.waw.pl> schrieb im
Newsbeitrag
news:bdpt62$do0$1@inews.gazeta.pl...
oh I do endo quite ok but I love training more and more and
discuss
differnces in treating
I am general but I do endo,cosmetic ,surgery in some
cases(imnplants
dyna )
and prosthetics,perio
:)))))

--
Joel M. Eichen, D.D.S.
Philadelphia PA

www.phillyducks.com
We>re Just A Duck Call Away!

STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies ~
meaning no one IN PENNSYLVANIA
has seen the tooth or teeth in
question so take this advice in
proper context ~ its the internet!

We is guessin'!

--
Joel M. Eichen, D.D.S.
Philadelphia PA

www.phillyducks.com
We>re Just A Duck Call Away!

STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies ~
meaning no one IN PENNSYLVANIA
has seen the tooth or teeth in
question so take this advice in
proper context ~ its the internet!

We is guessin'!

--
Serwis Usenet w portalu Gazeta.pl -> http://www.gazeta.pl/usenet/
[/quote]

--
Serwis Usenet w portalu Gazeta.pl -> http://www.gazeta.pl/usenet/

Krzysztof Polanowski · Guest

right in Nederlanden,implants are for community insurance,our fellows are
making implants (mostly) endo is tfu!(hardly ever) :)
Uzytkownik "Joel M. Eichen D.D.S." <joeleichen@yahoo.com> napisal w
wiadomosci news:b99jfvchtgp2reqr9ldgvi58b0cle3pmkk@4ax.com...
[quote]Statistically speaking, it has been shown that when a population
switches from fee-for-service to HMO (capitation) that lots of
"testing" goes out the window!

As example, extracting wisdom teeth decreases depending on who is
expected to pay for it! If it is part of a capitation program, and if
the doctor absorbs the cost for the monthly capitation fee, it
disappears!

Joel

On Tue, 24 Jun 2003 17:34:27 GMT, WubbaBubba <No_1@nowhere.net> wrote:

On Sun, 22 Jun 2003 12:07:35 -0400, Joel M. Eichen D.D.S.
joeleichen@yahoo.com> wrote:

Of course,
advocates of HMOs maintain that fee-for service encourages
overtreatment.

This is absolutely true!

I absolutely disagree !

Overtreatment is unethical as is undertreatment.

HMO advocates are only interested in lining their own
pockets and put the onus on the practitioner.

WB

--
Joel M. Eichen, D.D.S.
Philadelphia PA

www.phillyducks.com
We>re Just A Duck Call Away!

STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies ~
meaning no one IN PENNSYLVANIA
has seen the tooth or teeth in
question so take this advice in
proper context ~ its the internet!

We is guessin'!
[/quote]

--
Serwis Usenet w portalu Gazeta.pl -> http://www.gazeta.pl/usenet/


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