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Marc Verhaegen
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 Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 12:51 am Post subject: Homo came from Asia? |
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Yes, there are 2 independent indications that human ancestors (as opposed to
Afr.apes-apiths) not so long after the H/P split 5 or 4 Ma might have lived
predom.in S.Asia:
- The retroviral data suggest that our ancestors were absent from Africa
between 4 & 3 Ma at least.
- The earliest fossils of undoubted Homo come from Asia : Dmanisi & (if 1.8
Ma old) Mojokerto.
IMO, after the split with Pan in the E.Afr.littoral forest (see Jon.Kingdon
"Lowly origin"), Homo colonised the Ind.Ocean shores, and from there
offshoots trekked into the land along the rivers/lakes probably many times
in parallel (Gona etc.).
IOW, whether Homo came from Asia or Africa is perhaps less important than
saying that Homo came from the coasts.
--Marc
Marc,
I think it>s most likely that Homo came from Asia.
This was posted by Marcel over in Paleoanthropology:
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J Hum Evol. 2008 Oct 6.[Epub ahead of print]
Early evidence of the genus Homo in East Asia.
Zhu RX, Potts R, Pan YX, Yao HT, LÃ1Ž4 LQ, Zhao X, Gao X, Chen LW,
Gao F, Deng CL.
Paleomagnetism and Geochronology Laboratory (SKL-LE), Institute of
Geology and Geophysics, Chinese Academy of Sciences, Beijing 100029,
China.
The timing and route of the earliest dispersal from Africa to
Eastern Asia are contentious topics in the study of early human
evolution because Asian hominin fossil sites with precise age
constraints are very limited. Here we report new high-resolution
magnetostratigraphic results that place stringent age controls on
excavated hominin incisors and stone tools from the Yuanmou Basin,
southwest China. The hominin-bearing layer resides in a reverse
polarity magnetozone just above the upper boundary of the Olduvai
subchron, yielding an estimated age of 1.7Ma. The finding represents
the age of the earliest documented presence of Homo, with affinities
to Homo erectus, in mainland East Asia. This age estimate is roughly
the same as for H. erectus in island Southeast Asia and immediately
prior to the oldest archaeological evidence in northeast Asia.
Mammalian fauna and pollen obtained directly from the hominin site
indicate that the Yuanmou hominins lived in a varied habitat of open
vegetation with patches of bushland and forest on an alluvial fan
close to a lake or swamp. The age and location are consistent with a
rapid southern migration route of initial hominin populations into
Eastern Asia.
--
My response:
Thanks for posting this, Marcel. Very interesting.
Of course, an alternate explanation, which has not been dismissed by
any evidence that I>m aware of, and is supported by many pieces of
evidence (both circumstantial and direct,) is that the migration was
in the other direction, from SE Asia, to Africa. LB1>s affinities
with both Homo, and the other great apes, may place LB1,
morphologically, very close to the ancestral great ape condition
(very similar to the great ape LCA.) I suspect Homo first evolved
in the SE Asian islands, and that LB1 belonged to a population that
was less derived (more similar to the older lineage,) than the
population(s) from which the erectines (including "modern humans")
derived. (But note, Rampasassa claims of hybrid origin, complicates
that last statement; perhaps "modern humans" are not _only_
descended from erectines, but from some other lineage(s,) as well.)
P.S., let>s not forget Toumai, also very similar to LB1,
morphologically. A Toumai-like/LB1-like ancestor, in my opinion,
gradually evolved into Australopiths, and eventually chimps and
gorillas, in Africa.
Dan |
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Lee Olsen
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| Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 9:38 pm Post subject: Re: Homo came from Asia? |
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On Oct 17, 12:51 pm, Marc Verhaegen <m_verhae...@skynet.be> wrote:
[quote]Yes, there are 2 independent indications that human ancestors (as opposed to
Afr.apes-apiths) not so long after the H/P split 5 or 4 Ma might have lived
predom.in S.Asia:
[/quote]
Might have, might have not. |
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Marc Verhaegen
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| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2008 3:29 am Post subject: Re: Homo came from Asia? |
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[quote]Yes, there are 2 independent indications that human ancestors (as opposed to
Afr.apes-apiths) not so long after the H/P split 5 or 4 Ma might have lived
predom.in S.Asia:
[/quote]
Little Olson snips the arguments & produces the great wisdom:
> Might have, might have not. |
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RichTravsky
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| Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:19 am Post subject: Re: Homo came from Asia? |
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Marc Verhaegen wrote:
[quote]
Yes, there are 2 independent indications that human ancestors (as opposed to
Afr.apes-apiths) not so long after the H/P split 5 or 4 Ma might have lived
predom.in S.Asia:
- The retroviral data suggest that our ancestors were absent from Africa
between 4 & 3 Ma at least.
- The earliest fossils of undoubted Homo come from Asia : Dmanisi & (if 1.8
Ma old) Mojokerto.
[/quote]
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6WJS-4GFCSW2-1&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=94fbe698d4f77c3db6d3a23fc9b1ebd4
or
http://tinyurl.com/crf6m
Journal of Human Evolution
Volume 49, Issue 2 , August 2005, Pages 230-240
First occurrence of early Homo in the Nachukui Formation (West Turkana,
Kenya) at 2.3-2.4 Myr
Received 3 March 2004; accepted 25 March 2005. Available online 20 June 2005.
Abstract
...
In 2002 a new palaeoanthropological site (LA1greek small letter alpha), 100
meters south of the LA1 archaeological site, produced a first right lower
molar of a juvenile hominid (KNM-WT 42718). The relative small size of the
crown, its marked MD elongation and BL reduction, the relative position of
the cusps, the lack of a C6 and the mild expression of a protostylid,
reinforced by metrical analyses, demonstrate the distinctiveness of this tooth
compared with Australopithecus afarensis, A. anamensis, A. africanus and
Paranthropus boisei, and its similarity to early Homo. The LA1greek small
letter alpha site lies 2.2 m above the Ekalalei Tuff which is slightly younger
than Tuff F dated to 2.34 ± 0.04 Myr. This juvenile specimen represents the
oldest occurrence of the genus Homo in West Turkana.
... |
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Marc Verhaegen
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Nov 01, 2008 1:59 pm Post subject: Re: Homo came from Asia? |
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[quote]Yes, there are 2 independent indications that human ancestors (as opposed to
Afr.apes-apiths) not so long after the H/P split 5 or 4 Ma might have lived
predom.in S.Asia:
- The retroviral data suggest that our ancestors were absent from Africa
between 4 & 3 Ma at least.
- The earliest fossils of undoubted Homo come from Asia : Dmanisi & (if 1.8
Ma old) Mojokerto.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6WJS-4GFCSW2-1&_user
=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_url
Version=0&_userid=10&md5=94fbe698d4f77c3db6d3a23fc9b1ebd4
or
http://tinyurl.com/crf6m
Journal of Human Evolution
Volume 49, Issue 2 , August 2005, Pages 230-240
First occurrence of early Homo in the Nachukui Formation (West Turkana,
Kenya) at 2.3-2.4 Myr
Received 3 March 2004; accepted 25 March 2005. Available online 20 June 2005.
Abstract
...
In 2002 a new palaeoanthropological site (LA1greek small letter alpha), 100
meters south of the LA1 archaeological site, produced a first right lower
molar of a juvenile hominid (KNM-WT 42718). The relative small size of the
crown, its marked MD elongation and BL reduction, the relative position of
the cusps, the lack of a C6 and the mild expression of a protostylid,
reinforced by metrical analyses, demonstrate the distinctiveness of this
tooth
compared with Australopithecus afarensis, A. anamensis, A. africanus and
Paranthropus boisei, and its similarity to early Homo. The LA1greek small
letter alpha site lies 2.2 m above the Ekalalei Tuff which is slightly
younger
than Tuff F dated to 2.34 ± 0.04 Myr. This juvenile specimen represents the
oldest occurrence of the genus Homo in West Turkana.
[/quote]
answered in other post, see there |
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Lee Olsen
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Nov 01, 2008 10:04 pm Post subject: Re: Homo came from Asia? |
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On Oct 18, 3:29 pm, Marc Verhaegen <m_verhae...@skynet.be> wrote:
[quote]Little Olson snips the arguments & produces the great wisdom:
[/quote]
Says the wetloon who doesn>t know a capybara from a mountain beaver.
Do some running, you will live longer. |
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