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BradGuth
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 Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 4:11 pm Post subject: Re: ...NASA says....ASPARAGUS... Can Grow on Mars!!! |
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On Jul 6, 3:49 pm, "jonathan" <H...@write.instead.net> wrote:
[quote]trigonometry1...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7e373d1e-40a8-41e3-b8dc-078407cfa667@l64g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
If life is found on Mars, I suspect it is nearly "everywhere."
Understand I suspect Mars is sterile and life is rare.
That>s what I>d think also. I think that earth-like conditions
on Mars are intermittant and short-lived. Meaning life
should be much the same, simple and hard to find.
I think it>s very likely that at some point underground they>re
layers where good conditions do exist and persist.
My vision of this "soil' and life goes like the following:
space ships land and make glass and build domes and melt ice.
Robots and machines at humus imported from earth,
check chemistry and add microorganisms, plant seeds, etc.
Then humans come to the green domes of Mars.
I tend to limit future dreams to things that are just possible
and barely in my lifetime. As in, what could be, if we suddenly
started doing exactly all the right things to make that future
become a reality.
It seems science has been all about detailing what was/is, in order
to gain predictability of the future. With the notion that gaining
predictability of the future can help us shape and improve things.
But like predicting the weather, this objective method shows
it>s clear limitations in terms of time and reliability. The real
world cannot be predicted well enough in that way to
make a big difference.
But doing the opposite, having science begin by carefully designing
the ideal future, then figuring out the path from ..there to here..
has a far better chance of creating a better future.
We gain predictability of the future by making our vision happen!
Not with countless computers crunching complex equations!
Science should begin with our imagination of the future...a subjective
frame of reference. In order to truly gain control and understanding
of our existence.
There is a way to make subjective observations agree between
different observers. Complexity science has figured it out.
Just like with what Einstein taught us, without including the
observer in the observations, we can>t know the true
structure and simplicity of the universe.
s
[/quote]
Technically, at a $billion/kg, we could grow that ASPARAGUS on Pluto,
just couldn>t export it back to Earth or anywhere else.
What if that ASPARAGUS could be grown for $1000/kg on our Selene/moon
(including produce shipments back to Earth)?
Or, what-if that ASPARAGUS could be grown for $10/kg on Venus, where
at least the water and energy for sustaining the enclosed anti-
greenhouse environment need not be imported?
- Brad Guth Brad_Guth Brad.Guth BradGuth |
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jonathan
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 3:49 am Post subject: Re: ...NASA says....ASPARAGUS... Can Grow on Mars!!! |
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<trigonometry1972@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7e373d1e-40a8-41e3-b8dc-078407cfa667@l64g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
[quote]If life is found on Mars, I suspect it is nearly "everywhere."
Understand I suspect Mars is sterile and life is rare.
[/quote]
That>s what I>d think also. I think that earth-like conditions
on Mars are intermittant and short-lived. Meaning life
should be much the same, simple and hard to find.
I think it>s very likely that at some point underground they>re
layers where good conditions do exist and persist.
[quote]My vision of this "soil' and life goes like the following:
space ships land and make glass and build domes and melt ice.
Robots and machines at humus imported from earth,
check chemistry and add microorganisms, plant seeds, etc.
Then humans come to the green domes of Mars.
[/quote]
I tend to limit future dreams to things that are just possible
and barely in my lifetime. As in, what could be, if we suddenly
started doing exactly all the right things to make that future
become a reality.
It seems science has been all about detailing what was/is, in order
to gain predictability of the future. With the notion that gaining
predictability of the future can help us shape and improve things.
But like predicting the weather, this objective method shows
it>s clear limitations in terms of time and reliability. The real
world cannot be predicted well enough in that way to
make a big difference.
But doing the opposite, having science begin by carefully designing
the ideal future, then figuring out the path from ..there to here..
has a far better chance of creating a better future.
We gain predictability of the future by making our vision happen!
Not with countless computers crunching complex equations!
Science should begin with our imagination of the future...a subjective
frame of reference. In order to truly gain control and understanding
of our existence.
There is a way to make subjective observations agree between
different observers. Complexity science has figured it out.
Just like with what Einstein taught us, without including the
observer in the observations, we can>t know the true
structure and simplicity of the universe.
s |
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josephus
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:05 am Post subject: Re: ...NASA says....ASPARAGUS... Can Grow on Mars!!! |
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BradGuth wrote:
[quote]On Jul 6, 3:49 pm, "jonathan" <H...@write.instead.net> wrote:
trigonometry1...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7e373d1e-40a8-41e3-b8dc-078407cfa667@l64g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
If life is found on Mars, I suspect it is nearly "everywhere."
Understand I suspect Mars is sterile and life is rare.
That>s what I>d think also. I think that earth-like conditions
on Mars are intermittant and short-lived. Meaning life
should be much the same, simple and hard to find.
I think it>s very likely that at some point underground they>re
layers where good conditions do exist and persist.
My vision of this "soil' and life goes like the following:
space ships land and make glass and build domes and melt ice.
Robots and machines at humus imported from earth,
check chemistry and add microorganisms, plant seeds, etc.
Then humans come to the green domes of Mars.
I tend to limit future dreams to things that are just possible
and barely in my lifetime. As in, what could be, if we suddenly
started doing exactly all the right things to make that future
become a reality.
It seems science has been all about detailing what was/is, in order
to gain predictability of the future. With the notion that gaining
predictability of the future can help us shape and improve things.
But like predicting the weather, this objective method shows
it>s clear limitations in terms of time and reliability. The real
world cannot be predicted well enough in that way to
make a big difference.
But doing the opposite, having science begin by carefully designing
the ideal future, then figuring out the path from ..there to here..
has a far better chance of creating a better future.
We gain predictability of the future by making our vision happen!
Not with countless computers crunching complex equations!
Science should begin with our imagination of the future...a subjective
frame of reference. In order to truly gain control and understanding
of our existence.
There is a way to make subjective observations agree between
different observers. Complexity science has figured it out.
Just like with what Einstein taught us, without including the
observer in the observations, we can>t know the true
structure and simplicity of the universe.
s
Technically, at a $billion/kg, we could grow that ASPARAGUS on Pluto,
just couldn>t export it back to Earth or anywhere else.
What if that ASPARAGUS could be grown for $1000/kg on our Selene/moon
(including produce shipments back to Earth)?
Or, what-if that ASPARAGUS could be grown for $10/kg on Venus, where
at least the water and energy for sustaining the enclosed anti-
greenhouse environment need not be imported?
- Brad Guth Brad_Guth Brad.Guth BradGuth
[/quote]
on VENUS? at 650 degrees, it is boiling lead. those ASPARAGUS would
be charcoal. It is a bad example of global warming running away. VENUS
is HOT.
josephus
--
I go sailing in the summer
and look at stars in the winter,
"Everybody is ignorant but on different subjects"
--Will Rogers
Its not what you know that gets you in trouble
its what you know that aint so.
--josh billings. |
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BradGuth
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:42 am Post subject: Re: ...NASA says....ASPARAGUS... Can Grow on Mars!!! |
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On Jul 25, 3:05 pm, josephus <dogb...@earthlink.net> wrote:
[quote]BradGuth wrote:
On Jul 6, 3:49 pm, "jonathan" <H...@write.instead.net> wrote:
trigonometry1...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7e373d1e-40a8-41e3-b8dc-078407cfa667@l64g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
If life is found on Mars, I suspect it is nearly "everywhere."
Understand I suspect Mars is sterile and life is rare.
That>s what I>d think also. I think that earth-like conditions
on Mars are intermittant and short-lived. Meaning life
should be much the same, simple and hard to find.
I think it>s very likely that at some point underground they>re
layers where good conditions do exist and persist.
My vision of this "soil' and life goes like the following:
space ships land and make glass and build domes and melt ice.
Robots and machines at humus imported from earth,
check chemistry and add microorganisms, plant seeds, etc.
Then humans come to the green domes of Mars.
I tend to limit future dreams to things that are just possible
and barely in my lifetime. As in, what could be, if we suddenly
started doing exactly all the right things to make that future
become a reality.
It seems science has been all about detailing what was/is, in order
to gain predictability of the future. With the notion that gaining
predictability of the future can help us shape and improve things.
But like predicting the weather, this objective method shows
it>s clear limitations in terms of time and reliability. The real
world cannot be predicted well enough in that way to
make a big difference.
But doing the opposite, having science begin by carefully designing
the ideal future, then figuring out the path from ..there to here..
has a far better chance of creating a better future.
We gain predictability of the future by making our vision happen!
Not with countless computers crunching complex equations!
Science should begin with our imagination of the future...a subjective
frame of reference. In order to truly gain control and understanding
of our existence.
There is a way to make subjective observations agree between
different observers. Complexity science has figured it out.
Just like with what Einstein taught us, without including the
observer in the observations, we can>t know the true
structure and simplicity of the universe.
s
Technically, at a $billion/kg, we could grow that ASPARAGUS on Pluto,
just couldn>t export it back to Earth or anywhere else.
What if that ASPARAGUS could be grown for $1000/kg on our Selene/moon
(including produce shipments back to Earth)?
Or, what-if that ASPARAGUS could be grown for $10/kg on Venus, where
at least the water and energy for sustaining the enclosed anti-
greenhouse environment need not be imported?
- Brad Guth Brad_Guth Brad.Guth BradGuth
on VENUS? at 650 degrees, it is boiling lead. those ASPARAGUS would
be charcoal. It is a bad example of global warming running away. VENUS
is HOT.
josephus
[/quote]
With unlimited renewable local energy and perhaps hundreds of
teratonnes of easily obtained water within them thar acidic clouds,
what>s all that insurmountable?
Haven>t you ever heard of the Guth anti-greenhouse?
How much Venus indoors snow and I would you like?
Are you still insisting upon our doing Venus in the buff?
- Brad Guth Brad_Guth Brad.Guth BradGuth |
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BradGuth
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:56 pm Post subject: Re: ...NASA says....ASPARAGUS... Can Grow on Mars!!! |
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If we manage to place a human turd on Mars, nothing will ever grow out
of it, not even asparagus unless it>s of a rad-hard hybrid form of
asparagus that doesn>t mind the more than sub-freezing cold, the
vacuum and lack of water.
- Brad Guth Brad_Guth Brad.Guth BradGuth
jonathan wrote:
[quote]Well...don>t go dumping your asparagus stocks just yet....
NY Times
Alkaline Soil Sample From Mars Reveals Presence of Nutrients for
Plants to Grow
By KENNETH CHANG
"We basically have found what appears to be the requirements, the
nutrients, to support life whether past, present or future," said
Samuel P. Kounaves of Tufts University, who is leading the
chemical analysis, during a telephone news conference on Thursday.
"The sort of soil you have there is the type of soil you>d probably
have in your backyard."
"Plants that like alkaline soil - like asparagus - might readily grow
in the Martian soil"
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/27/science/space/27MARS.html?ref=science[/quote] |
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