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chazwin
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 Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:52 pm Post subject: Re: Even Manhatten Project Wasn>t "On the Fly" R&D |
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On Jul 26, 3:09 pm, Day Brown <daybr...@daybrown.org> wrote:
[quote]chazwin wrote:
Too little too late.
Let>s face it, as a species, we ain>t gonna make it!
We will either f ck the world up over some idiotic religious/
ideological argument and blow the shit out of each other, or we will
just wind down when the oil and other fossil fuels are used up. We can
always go back to hunting and gathering!
The most dangerous time for nuclear holocaust will be when the
resource gap will begin to tighten. The Western powers will find
increasing numbers of excuses to invade, destabilise and control the
dwindling resources. Within 30 years there will be US troops in a
radioactive Iran.
You know why there are no Iranians on Star Trek?
Cause Star Trek is about the future.
As for the Jews?
That>s the Ferengi.
[/quote]
Star Trek was devised when Russia was the great foe. Klingons
represented them, and by the time of Peristroika, Klingons were at
peace with the Feds. Perhaps you would like to account for the fact
that the Ferengi were unknon in the time of Kirk? Maybe the Jews
didn>t exist either.
In any event there are plenty of candidates for the Iranians.
And I think it is easy to take this idea too far.
[quote]
But, right now, I>m about half way thru "Infidel" by Ayaan Hirsi Ali.
The Iranians have a lotta jackass company. And while the Africans,
Arabs, and other Moslems are outbreeding everyone else, we know that
booms tend to go to bust.
[/quote]
Look to your own shores for that, and see my thread on "Proud to be
American". The crack are begining to show and the credit crunch is
gonna change things in a big way. America>s time may be coming to a
close. It will be accelerated if it keeps up the military pretence
that it simply cannot afford whilst it slips away from the top of the
standard of living index to become a "developing country".
The NeoCons have to realise that you have to spread money for the
economy to work; concentrating it at the top gives you a banana
repulblic.
[quote]
I>ve been having some fun telling Liberals that in a one-man/one-vote
system, they are outbreeding everyone else and will elect what passes
for leadership. The Serbs figured out that>s what the Catholic Croats
and Albanian Muslims were up to, and found Malosevic, a true patriot, to
deal with it for them, and as Machiavelli said, taking the guilt for the
action away with him while they get to enjoy the fruits of the new
status quo; in this case, a relatively pure Serbia.
[/quote]
Irrelevant BS
[quote]
But what Ayaan shows us going on among the Muslim clerics in Africa and
Saudi Arabia looks a lot like what>s going on with US Christian fundies.
And while these jackasses can get a lotta stupid sheeple behind them,
they cant really organize and kind of innovative responses to new or
unexpected challenges, such as the decline of oil production.
[/quote]
So what?
[quote]
And yes, I spoze the most of the planet is headed for famine. But when
you look at the collapse of empires all thru history, you>ll repeatedly
find some communities that figured out what was coming down, and made
the most of the opportunity to rid themselves of taxes that were no
longer doing them any good.
[/quote]
Twat! Low tax is a recipe for economic disaster.
[quote]
I might suggest also, that the nuke thing is, if you>ll pardon the pun,
overblown. The power elites have a vested interest in scaring us about
nukes, but the fact is you havta take a nuke down off the shelf every 18
months to refine the lead out of it. (remember radioactive decay?) And
as we see with Katrina, the MPLS bridge, the fucked up way the wars are
being run, and similar kinds of ineptitude in Russia, I aint so sure
they can really organize enuf competent people to make nukes any more.
[/quote]
Irrelevant BS
[quote]
Not that I>d want to live in a city to see. But you dont have to. There
is ongoing investment in small towns and cities that have populations
that dont move around as much because all their kin live there. Employee
turnover is lower, and transnats have figured that out. Remember Blade
Runner? Critical infrastructure is quietly being moved out of the high
risk urban areas into rural obscurity. What else would you do about WMD?
[/quote]
Irrelevant BS |
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Day Brown
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:09 pm Post subject: Re: Even Manhatten Project Wasn>t "On the Fly" R&D |
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chazwin wrote:
[quote]Too little too late.
Let>s face it, as a species, we ain>t gonna make it!
We will either f ck the world up over some idiotic religious/
ideological argument and blow the shit out of each other, or we will
just wind down when the oil and other fossil fuels are used up. We can
always go back to hunting and gathering!
The most dangerous time for nuclear holocaust will be when the
resource gap will begin to tighten. The Western powers will find
increasing numbers of excuses to invade, destabilise and control the
dwindling resources. Within 30 years there will be US troops in a
radioactive Iran.
You know why there are no Iranians on Star Trek?[/quote]
Cause Star Trek is about the future.
As for the Jews?
That>s the Ferengi.
But, right now, I>m about half way thru "Infidel" by Ayaan Hirsi Ali.
The Iranians have a lotta jackass company. And while the Africans,
Arabs, and other Moslems are outbreeding everyone else, we know that
booms tend to go to bust.
I>ve been having some fun telling Liberals that in a one-man/one-vote
system, they are outbreeding everyone else and will elect what passes
for leadership. The Serbs figured out that>s what the Catholic Croats
and Albanian Muslims were up to, and found Malosevic, a true patriot, to
deal with it for them, and as Machiavelli said, taking the guilt for the
action away with him while they get to enjoy the fruits of the new
status quo; in this case, a relatively pure Serbia.
But what Ayaan shows us going on among the Muslim clerics in Africa and
Saudi Arabia looks a lot like what>s going on with US Christian fundies.
And while these jackasses can get a lotta stupid sheeple behind them,
they cant really organize and kind of innovative responses to new or
unexpected challenges, such as the decline of oil production.
And yes, I spoze the most of the planet is headed for famine. But when
you look at the collapse of empires all thru history, you>ll repeatedly
find some communities that figured out what was coming down, and made
the most of the opportunity to rid themselves of taxes that were no
longer doing them any good.
I might suggest also, that the nuke thing is, if you>ll pardon the pun,
overblown. The power elites have a vested interest in scaring us about
nukes, but the fact is you havta take a nuke down off the shelf every 18
months to refine the lead out of it. (remember radioactive decay?) And
as we see with Katrina, the MPLS bridge, the fucked up way the wars are
being run, and similar kinds of ineptitude in Russia, I aint so sure
they can really organize enuf competent people to make nukes any more.
Not that I>d want to live in a city to see. But you dont have to. There
is ongoing investment in small towns and cities that have populations
that dont move around as much because all their kin live there. Employee
turnover is lower, and transnats have figured that out. Remember Blade
Runner? Critical infrastructure is quietly being moved out of the high
risk urban areas into rural obscurity. What else would you do about WMD? |
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Tom Potter
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:53 pm Post subject: Re: Even Manhatten Project Wasn>t "On the Fly" R&D |
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"chazwin" <chazwyman@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:55e08e82-a64b-42b5-90a4-ccb6477d6775@d77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
[quote]On Jul 4, 7:07 pm, Bret Cahill <BretCah...@aol.com> wrote:
Not to diminish the bomb effort but at least they knew E=mc^2 three
decades before they started.
Now with peak oil everyone wants really fundamental research done "on
the wing."
They want "new mature" green industries yesterday.
I>m not saying that breakthroughs are impossible in this climate.
"When a man knows he>s going to be hung in a fortnight, it
concentrates the mind wonderfully" applies to everyone.
I>m just saying that attitude makes me really really nervous.
Bret Cahill
Too little too late.
Let>s face it, as a species, we ain>t gonna make it!
We will either f ck the world up over some idiotic religious/
ideological argument and blow the shit out of each other, or we will
just wind down when the oil and other fossil fuels are used up. We can
always go back to hunting and gathering!
The most dangerous time for nuclear holocaust will be when the
resource gap will begin to tighten. The Western powers will find
increasing numbers of excuses to invade, destabilise and control the
dwindling resources. Within 30 years there will be US troops in a
radioactive Iran.
[/quote]
Hydrogen is not the most abundant thing in the universe,
stupidity is.
It is clear that, like Bush,
most people are ignorant of the consequences
of instigating Iraq or Russia into a war.
It amazes me to see people in the media,
in government, in the military, and idiots posting
on the net, smugly talking about Invading Iran,
and having American troops waging war
with people all over the world.
The fact of the matter is,
if America attacked either Iran or Russia,
or if Iran or Russia seriously thought that
America was going to invade either of those nations,
they wouldn>t sit still for a moment.
They would take out the oil shipping infrastructure
in the Persian Gulf, and America and Western Europe will
begin a rapid decline back into the stone age.
Also Russia would immediate shut off the natural gas
to Western Europe, and Argentina would cease shipping oil
to America.
The reason Germany lost WWII,
was because the Russian sabotaged their oil wells,
and Germany couldn>t get enough oil
to support their military and factories.
The Germans couldn>t get to the Middle East oil,
but made a effort in that direction to tie up
Allied troops to prevent them from doing so.
If the Persian Gulf oil shipping infrastructure were taken out,
America would be in far worse shape than Germany was,
because America>s economy and military consumes far
more energy, and the people America wants to wage war against
are much farther away than Moscow was from Germany.
There is about 59 days of import protection
in the Strategic Petroleum Reserve,
and a maximum of 4.4 million barrels per day can be withdrawn.
Considering that America uses 20 million barrels per day,
it does not take a system engineer to comprehend
that if Iran and/or Russia destroys the oil shipping infrastructure
in the Persian Gulf America, will come to a screeching halt.
Perhaps one of these saber rattlers
to explain to me how to maintain America,
and wage a war that would be many times more
costly in oil, material, limbs, and lives,
than the Iraqi War.
No gas to wage the war.
No gas to rebuild the oil shipping infrastructure.
No gas for cars, trucks and buses.
No heating and cooling for your homes.
No electricity for your computers.
No gas to operate the farms, factories, and trucks.
In fact, if Saddam had considered what would happen to
him, his family and his country, he would have taken out
the oil infrastructure in Iraq, Kuwait, and the Persian Gulf.
The ONLY rational options in today>s world,
are conservation and live and let live.
It is INSANITY to even consider
waging wars that consume large amounts of energy,
or wars that will force the enemy to disrupt the supply of energy.
About ten nations have the capability of
taking out the World>s energy supply,
and make it impossible for a major war to be waged against them
or anyone, and after seeing what happened to Saddam,
there is no doubt that several of the nations would
use the "Dooms Day Strategy",
as they would have nothing to lose.
They would be bombed,
but not occupied.
--
Tom Potter
http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html
http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com
http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos
http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** |
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V for Vendicar
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:11 am Post subject: Re: Even Manhatten Project Wasn>t "On the Fly" R&D |
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"chazwin" <chazwyman@yahoo.com> wrote
[quote]Star Trek was devised when Russia was the great foe. Klingons
represented them, and by the time of Peristroika, Klingons were at
peace with the Feds. Perhaps you would like to account for the fact
that the Ferengi were unknon in the time of Kirk? Maybe the Jews
didn>t exist either.
In any event there are plenty of candidates for the Iranians.
[/quote]
Well According to the KKKonservatives at the Wall Street Journal, Bush is
Batman.
Yup, the AmeriKKKan people are now so stupid, that even their business
leadership has to have
the world presented to them in Comic Book Form.
I know several people who managed various U.S. businesses, and they inform
me that without training
comic books, they could never train their Illiterate, Dysfunctional,
AmeriKKKan Employees..
You know. Here in the Socialist states - we can read technical manuals,
and don>t need to have them
predigested into comic book form.
Ahahahahahahahaah |
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Tom Potter
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 1:37 pm Post subject: Re: Even Manhatten Project Wasn>t "On the Fly" R&D |
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On Jul 26, 5:45 pm, chazwin <chazwy...@yahoo.com> wrote:
[quote]On Jul 4, 7:07 pm, Bret Cahill <BretCah...@aol.com> wrote:
Not to diminish the bomb effort but at least they knew E=mc^2 three
decades before they started.
Now with peak oil everyone wants really fundamental research done "on
the wing."
They want "new mature" green industries yesterday.
I>m not saying that breakthroughs are impossible in this climate.
"When a man knows he>s going to be hung in a fortnight, it
concentrates the mind wonderfully" applies to everyone.
I>m just saying that attitude makes me really really nervous.
Bret Cahill
Too little too late.
Let>s face it, as a species, we ain>t gonna make it!
We will either f ck the world up over some idiotic religious/
ideological argument and blow the shit out of each other, or we will
just wind down when the oil and other fossil fuels are used up. We can
always go back to hunting and gathering!
The most dangerous time for nuclear holocaust will be when the
resource gap will begin to tighten. The Western powers will find
increasing numbers of excuses to invade, destabilise and control the
dwindling resources. Within 30 years there will be US troops in a
radioactive Iran.
[/quote]
Hydrogen is not the most abundant thing in the universe,
stupidity is.
It is clear that, like Bush,
most people are ignorant of the consequences
of instigating Iraq or Russia into a war.
It amazes me to see people in the media,
in government, in the military, and idiots posting
on the net, smugly talking about Invading Iran,
and having American troops waging war
with people all over the world.
The fact of the matter is,
if America attacked either Iran or Russia,
or if Iran or Russia seriously thought that
America was going to invade either of those nations,
they wouldn>t sit still for a moment.
They would take out the oil shipping infrastructure
in the Persian Gulf, and America and Western Europe will
begin a rapid decline back into the stone age.
Also Russia would immediate shut off the natural gas
to Western Europe, and Argentina would cease shipping oil
to America.
The reason Germany lost WWII,
was because the Russian sabotaged their oil wells,
and Germany couldn>t get enough oil
to support their military and factories.
The Germans couldn>t get to the Middle East oil,
but made a effort in that direction to tie up
Allied troops to prevent them from doing so.
If the Persian Gulf oil shipping infrastructure were taken out,
America would be in far worse shape than Germany was,
because America>s economy and military consumes far
more energy, and the people America wants to wage war against
are much farther away than Moscow was from Germany.
There is about 59 days of import protection
in the Strategic Petroleum Reserve,
and a maximum of 4.4 million barrels per day can be withdrawn.
Considering that America uses 20 million barrels per day,
it does not take a system engineer to comprehend
that if Iran and/or Russia destroys the oil shipping infrastructure
in the Persian Gulf America, will come to a screeching halt.
Perhaps one of these saber rattlers
to explain to me how to maintain America,
and wage a war that would be many times more
costly in oil, material, limbs, and lives,
than the Iraqi War.
No gas to wage the war.
No gas to rebuild the oil shipping infrastructure.
No gas for cars, trucks and buses.
No heating and cooling for your homes.
No electricity for your computers.
No gas to operate the farms, factories, and trucks.
In fact, if Saddam had considered what would happen to
him, his family and his country, he would have taken out
the oil infrastructure in Iraq, Kuwait, and the Persian Gulf.
The ONLY rational options in today>s world,
are conservation and live and let live.
It is INSANITY to even consider
waging wars that consume large amounts of energy,
or wars that will force the enemy to disrupt the supply of energy.
About ten nations have the capability of
taking out the World>s energy supply,
and make it impossible for a major war to be waged against them
or anyone, and after seeing what happened to Saddam,
there is no doubt that several of the nations would
use the "Dooms Day Strategy",
as they would have nothing to lose.
They would be bombed,
but not occupied.
--
Tom Potter
http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html
http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com
http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos
http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm |
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Day Brown
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:05 am Post subject: Re: Even Manhatten Project Wasn>t "On the Fly" R&D |
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Tom Potter wrote:
[quote]Hydrogen is not the most abundant thing in the universe,
stupidity is.
Right; and if oil exports to Europe and America stopped, agribusiness[/quote]
there would stop, and there>d be global famine everywhere else.
As for Europe and America, there>s already an expansion in "organic"
farming and gardening that could be ramped up quickly to provide enuf
turnips to get everyone thru the winter while all the other regions you
mention fucking starved. Like so much of Africa is doing already.
Yeah, I know the rhetoric is way overblown. |
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Day Brown
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:05 am Post subject: Re: Even Manhatten Project Wasn>t "On the Fly" R&D |
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chazwin wrote:
[quote]You know why there are no Iranians on Star Trek?
Cause Star Trek is about the future.
As for the Jews?
That>s the Ferengi.
Star Trek was devised when Russia was the great foe. Klingons
represented them, and by the time of Peristroika, Klingons were at
peace with the Feds. Perhaps you would like to account for the fact
that the Ferengi were unknon in the time of Kirk? Maybe the Jews
didn>t exist either.
In any event there are plenty of candidates for the Iranians.
And I think it is easy to take this idea too far.
Damn Chaz, you took the fucking joke literally.[/quote]
[quote]But, right now, I>m about half way thru "Infidel" by Ayaan Hirsi Ali.
The Iranians have a lotta jackass company. And while the Africans,
Arabs, and other Moslems are outbreeding everyone else, we know that
booms tend to go to bust.
Look to your own shores for that, and see my thread on "Proud to be
American". The crack are begining to show and the credit crunch is
gonna change things in a big way. America>s time may be coming to a
close. It will be accelerated if it keeps up the military pretence
that it simply cannot afford whilst it slips away from the top of the
standard of living index to become a "developing country".
The NeoCons have to realise that you have to spread money for the
economy to work; concentrating it at the top gives you a banana
repulblic.
The voice in her film on youtube is American, not British English. The[/quote]
book, which among other things, shows the failure of Dutch liberalism,
which is far left of the American version, to deal effectively with
Islamic immigrants. The book, Infidel makes it clear to me that we need
to get away from partisan group think to see WTF is going on.
[quote]I>ve been having some fun telling Liberals that in a one-man/one-vote
system, they are outbreeding everyone else and will elect what passes
for leadership. The Serbs figured out that>s what the Catholic Croats
and Albanian Muslims were up to, and found Malosevic, a true patriot, to
deal with it for them, and as Machiavelli said, taking the guilt for the
action away with him while they get to enjoy the fruits of the new
status quo; in this case, a relatively pure Serbia.
Irrelevant BS
Read Milgram>s studies on obedience. He showed how Americans will follow[/quote]
orders just like Nazis did.
[quote]But what Ayaan shows us going on among the Muslim clerics in Africa and
Saudi Arabia looks a lot like what>s going on with US Christian fundies.
And while these jackasses can get a lotta stupid sheeple behind them,
they cant really organize and kind of innovative responses to new or
unexpected challenges, such as the decline of oil production.
So what?
So, while the climb to Hubbard>s peak oil followed a smooth bell curve,[/quote]
coming down off it will be precipitous. We need to invest less in golden
parachutes and figure out how to hang on while we endow innovation to
find a way to get down to some sustainable level of energy.
[quote]And yes, I spoze the most of the planet is headed for famine. But when
you look at the collapse of empires all thru history, you>ll repeatedly
find some communities that figured out what was coming down, and made
the most of the opportunity to rid themselves of taxes that were no
longer doing them any good.
Twat! Low tax is a recipe for economic disaster.
Denmark, Sweden, Holland, & Germany, to name a few, have high taxes,[/quote]
but then high incomes. For middle class people. They dont reward the
power elites like the economies you admire. Somalia, Ethiopia, Kenya, et
al, have lower taxes than here if you like low taxes.
[quote]I might suggest also, that the nuke thing is, if you>ll pardon the pun,
overblown. The power elites have a vested interest in scaring us about
nukes, but the fact is you havta take a nuke down off the shelf every 18
months to refine the lead out of it. (remember radioactive decay?) And
as we see with Katrina, the MPLS bridge, the fucked up way the wars are
being run, and similar kinds of ineptitude in Russia, I aint so sure
they can really organize enuf competent people to make nukes any more.
Irrelevant BS
I see you>ve not had the time to read Gibbon or Machiavelli either. Did[/quote]
Orwell slip your mind as well? Suffice to say that we have an unstable
situation, and determining what will be relevant determines success, or
even survival. When a situation is intractable, the usual reason is that
you dont really understand it.
[quote]Not that I>d want to live in a city to see. But you dont have to. There
is ongoing investment in small towns and cities that have populations
that dont move around as much because all their kin live there. Employee
turnover is lower, and transnats have figured that out. Remember Blade
Runner? Critical infrastructure is quietly being moved out of the high
risk urban areas into rural obscurity. What else would you do about WMD?
Irrelevant BS
If you dont need to make investments or try to build a career, spoze so.[/quote]
I see however, that NW Arkansas now has a net IMMIGRATION of
engineers and scientific professionals from California and other high
tech areas.
If you are young enuf to still have a future, it is relevant. |
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